Exactly!

Other differences inclde the Future Fashion Show, where the real competition is in the designs, and the presentation is a chance to see how well you can interpret someone else’s designs. Traditionally the awards have been limited to 3 – best costume made by the designer, best made by someone else, and possibly Best In Show. Those 3 events go back to CC1, and are required at all CCs. The presentation is more like an actual fashion show, and if you can get a runway, so much the beter. It’s up to tech.

More recently the Single Pattern has been added, and that is totally pre-judged in the Green Room. Some of the patterns used have been bras & codpieces.

Other events have been added over the years – the doll competition & the quilt/wearable art show for some. Others have included The Iron Costumer competition (Ghods, what chaotic fun that was!) and the Costumers’ Runway show, which ran for 2 days of intense competition.

Besides events like Costume College – which is all learning, and very hard to get into – CCs are the only cons which are all costumeings all the time. With the rising through the roof costs of WorldCons, many of us only go to CCs lately.

They really ARE different!

In my experience, the CC SF&F Masquerade is in most ways similar to a

well-run high-level masquerade.

The Historical is different, because there has evolved an expectation that

all garments must be examined up close by all judges. This requires setting

up an interview schedule for all entries, which is quite different from the

way a “standard” masquerade is judged. (Personally, I’d like to see CC find

a space for the “I just want to go across the stage” kind of entry in the

historical, but that is a different discussion).

Elaine’s comments about the shared technical services is a good one,

although at Worldcon, the Hugos and Masquerade also usually share a setup.

Kevin

On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Jamie Butler <utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com>wrote:

> Thank you for putting this out here stace. I honestly was too terrified to

> ask myself after judging in this year’s st masq. I was all set to be CC34’s

> historical masquerade director and after reading the emails and seeing how

> passionate everyone got about what a CC masquerade should be, I’ve

> questioned if I should all together.

>

> Jamie Butler

> President of Madison Area Costuming Society

> Member of the Guilde of St George

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

>

>

> ————————————

>

> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!

> Groups Links

>

>

>

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

You’ve been to Archon, CCs are not that different from Archon. Yet very different from some other conventions.

But back to Archon – a known quantity to you & Jamie. The only significant difference between Archon and a CC F&SF is that there are generally more awards at a CC. But not always, that can be affected by an MD or Con-Chair decision. Aside from that, Archon is very like if not better than a CC F&SF.

CC Historical is different in the breadth of judging; documentation, workmanship & stage are usually judged as three seperate portions of the masque. That is also not written in stone but becoming more of the “standard” for CCs aligning itself with the “excellence deserves recognition” credo.

Does that help?

Nora

— On Wed, 6/5/13, staceylee25 <staceylee25@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: staceylee25 <staceylee25@yahoo.com>
Subject: [runacc] Masquerades in general
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 5, 2013, 2:36 PM

Not that I want to derail the current topic entirely (it’s good to discuss, I’m reading avidly) but I’m reminded of something I’ve been intending to ask the runacc conclave for a few months now. No time like the present, given the topic.

While I’ve never personally directed a masquerade, I’ve competed in more than I can count, judged somewhere around 8-10, and lived in the same household as two directors, as well as been to 4 CCs now. I feel like I have a pretty good grasp of how a quality masquerade is run and judged. That’s not to say I’m not going to take a few steps to double-reassure myself but that’s not for this discussion. But given the foibles seen at CC31, which I’m also not going to review just now, there has been a lot of talk of “but CC is different!”

HOW different?

I want to know whether there are any actual structural, logistical differences between CostumeCon and any major genre convention that uses ICG guidelines (Archon, CONvergence, etc), or if the difference is only in expectations. Because when I break down the details, from where I sit, it looks like the way the masquerade is run is pretty much exactly the same as anything I’ve judged, competed in, or helped run. The only difference that I can see is that there are subjective expectations that differ from genre cons. And, anyone who has spent any length of time hanging around CC vets will pick up some of that subjectivity by listening to their opinions.

This matters to me because I wanted to know whether implementing a slightly different judging system and awards structure (while still adhering to the standard “Merit deserves reward” philosophy) would cause people to flip tables, or if it was up to the whim of the director. Informal surveying has only ever given me the answer “it’s up to the director.” And, it also matters because I’m concerned that costumers from younger chapters may not be encouraged to step up and become the next generation of CC directors, judges, and volunteers when they’re intimidated by talk of how different it is. If we continually dump masquerade responsibilities on the same vets every year, do we not risk burning them out while also not ever training up the next generation to take their place?

I’d like to hear general opinions on what the vets believe is so “different” about a CC masquerade compared to any midsize-to-large genre con that runs using ICG guidelines. I’m not talking about the popularity contests at GenCon or the ridiculous lack of standards for workmanship at rinky-dink first-year anime and relaxicons, I’m talking about competitions that are generally understood as being some of the best-run and best-judged. IS there a difference? If so, what IS the difference? Is it only in how people feel like the entrants should be treated? In how many awards should be given out? The atmosphere backstage? Or is there some kind of secret handshake that only CC directors know that has to be taught?

It’s not going to stop me from directing, but I’m curious to hear opinions.

Stace
MACS vp and CC34 secretary

————————————

View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

That’s really up to each concom. I know of no general rule to that effect. Of course, it might be impossible for an entrant without at least a one-day membership to participate in tech rehearsal, which would make a day membership at least a de facto requirement.

Byron

On Jun 4, 2013, at 9:50 PM, bruno@soulmasque.com wrote:

> It has always been my understanding that to enter a masquerade, you
> have to have at least a one day membership for the day of the
> masquerade.
>
> Michael
>
> On 2013-06-04 04:16, Nora & Bruce Mai wrote:
> > You’d have to ask Henry but I know that one entrant at CC31 wanted to
> > just
> > enter the FSF and (I think) Henry told him that he’d probably have to
> > pay
> > for at least a one-day, Saturday.
> > I overheard part of this cause I was taking entrants for the SP right
> > next
> > to him, but he’d have to give you the factual details.
> >
> > Nora
> >
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Stace —

I ‘ve run SF masquerades at a CC and at regional cons and worldcons. I been to more than 20 CCs and I don’t think the CC SF masquerade is very different from that at a well-run regional sf con or a worldcon. One difference, as Elaine has noted, is that the MD doesn’t have to worry about finding and organizing tech, backstage, green room, official photography, and so forth. They’re usually the same for all events. (I volunteered to run the green room for all CC 34 events.) Usually, CC’s have a basic set of rules for all events, covering such things as no live mike and no peanut butter; these need not be included in the individual MD’s rules. Some CC’s have used the same MC for all events, too. Aside from that support, the contestant info and rules and the judges’ instructions are pretty much the same as at a regional con or worldcon. Where differences may arise is in the MD’s information and rules for entrants and judges. Some MDs may not have read carefully the Fairness Guidelines or may have decided to simplify their own rules (e.g., by collapsing skill divisions). That’s fine. The MD makes the rules and the ICG guidelines are just that: guidelines, not rules. However, when I ran Arisia and Philcon masquerades, as well as Anticipation and Chicon, I hewed to the terms of the guidelines very closely. Other MD’s have done so, too. I believe most experienced CC attendees would expect the SF MD to do so.

The historical masquerade, on the other hand, is rather different. I’ve run three of them and am running the next one. First, it’s the only one. Regional SF cons and worldcons may permit historical entries in their SF masquerades; however, those entries usually don’t really fit the masquerade’s theme or purpose. At CCs, the historical is the historical is the historical., It differs not only in topic but also in the approach the entrants take. While there are some who believe “historical” ought to be pronounced “hysterical” (I am one of them), humor is rare in historical entries (but see “The Battle of the Bulge” at CC 17: http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3636&g2_page=2), group entries are less often seen, and the typical entry is one entrant presenting one recreation of a period garment.

In addition, the historical requires the entrants to prepare documentation in support of their entries and requires the judges to review and judge the documentation. In addition, every entrant is required to meet with the judges to review his or her workmanship, for mandatory judging (unlike the voluntary workmanship judging in an SF masquerade. This takes a huge amount of time for the judges, who usually are unable to do anything else on Sunday — and maybe Saturday, depending on how large the show becomes. The MD needs to manage the schedule to some extent and check periodically that the judging is reasonably on schedule (it often is not). As a result, the judges normally make awards in three independent categories: documentation, workmanship, and presentation on stage and it’s not unknown for the total of awards across the three categories to exceed the total of entries (even though some entries receive no awards).

Unlike for SF masquerades, the MD’s information and rules also must address the requirements for documentation as well as other aspects of the competition. See my info for the CC 32 historical as one example (http://costumecon32.com/programming-2014/competitions-events/historical-masquerade/). The Costume-Con web site (http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php) includes other sets of rules.

One general difference is that any any CC masquerade, the audience may be a bit sparse, as so many attendees are either entering the competition or helping to run it! 🙂

I hope this helps, please get back to us with your reactions, comments and questions. We all want 34 to be a success.

Byron

On Jun 5, 2013, at 3:36 PM, staceylee25 <staceylee25@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Not that I want to derail the current topic entirely (it’s good to discuss, I’m reading avidly) but I’m reminded of something I’ve been intending to ask the runacc conclave for a few months now. No time like the present, given the topic.
>
> While I’ve never personally directed a masquerade, I’ve competed in more than I can count, judged somewhere around 8-10, and lived in the same household as two directors, as well as been to 4 CCs now. I feel like I have a pretty good grasp of how a quality masquerade is run and judged. That’s not to say I’m not going to take a few steps to double-reassure myself but that’s not for this discussion. But given the foibles seen at CC31, which I’m also not going to review just now, there has been a lot of talk of “but CC is different!”
>
> HOW different?
>
> I want to know whether there are any actual structural, logistical differences between CostumeCon and any major genre convention that uses ICG guidelines (Archon, CONvergence, etc), or if the difference is only in expectations. Because when I break down the details, from where I sit, it looks like the way the masquerade is run is pretty much exactly the same as anything I’ve judged, competed in, or helped run. The only difference that I can see is that there are subjective expectations that differ from genre cons. And, anyone who has spent any length of time hanging around CC vets will pick up some of that subjectivity by listening to their opinions.
>
> This matters to me because I wanted to know whether implementing a slightly different judging system and awards structure (while still adhering to the standard “Merit deserves reward” philosophy) would cause people to flip tables, or if it was up to the whim of the director. Informal surveying has only ever given me the answer “it’s up to the director.” And, it also matters because I’m concerned that costumers from younger chapters may not be encouraged to step up and become the next generation of CC directors, judges, and volunteers when they’re intimidated by talk of how different it is. If we continually dump masquerade responsibilities on the same vets every year, do we not risk burning them out while also not ever training up the next generation to take their place?
>
> I’d like to hear general opinions on what the vets believe is so “different” about a CC masquerade compared to any midsize-to-large genre con that runs using ICG guidelines. I’m not talking about the popularity contests at GenCon or the ridiculous lack of standards for workmanship at rinky-dink first-year anime and relaxicons, I’m talking about competitions that are generally understood as being some of the best-run and best-judged. IS there a difference? If so, what IS the difference? Is it only in how people feel like the entrants should be treated? In how many awards should be given out? The atmosphere backstage? Or is there some kind of secret handshake that only CC directors know that has to be taught?
>
> It’s not going to stop me from directing, but I’m curious to hear opinions.
>
> Stace
> MACS vp and CC34 secretary
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jamie —

Don’t you dare bail! We need new blood and we haven’t executed an MD yet! I ran the historicals at 24, 25, and 29 and am running the one at 32. I’ll be happy to work with you and I’m confident other historical MDs will be, too.

See my comments on the historical in my response to Stace.

Byron

On Jun 5, 2013, at 3:49 PM, Jamie Butler <utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Thank you for putting this out here stace. I honestly was too terrified to ask myself after judging in this year’s st masq. I was all set to be CC34’s historical masquerade director and after reading the emails and seeing how passionate everyone got about what a CC masquerade should be, I’ve questioned if I should all together.
>
> Jamie Butler
> President of Madison Area Costuming Society
> Member of the Guilde of St George
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jamie,
This is exactly what I meant earlier: Attach yourself to Byron next year and you will learn a lot! Do the same at 33, because each MD has different ways to handle the same situations. It’s a good way to avoid silly mis-steps.
Elaine

>
>
> Jamie —
>
> Don’t you dare bail! We need new blood and we haven’t executed an MD yet! I ran the historicals at 24, 25, and 29 and am running the one at 32. I’ll be happy to work with you and I’m confident other historical MDs will be, too.
>
> See my comments on the historical in my response to Stace.
>
> Byron
>
>
> On Jun 5, 2013, at 3:49 PM, Jamie Butler <utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Thank you for putting this out here stace. I honestly was too terrified to ask myself after judging in this year’s st masq. I was all set to be CC34’s historical masquerade director and after reading the emails and seeing how passionate everyone got about what a CC masquerade should be, I’ve questioned if I should all together.
> >
> > Jamie Butler
> > President of Madison Area Costuming Society
> > Member of the Guilde of St George
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yes, definitely – we’re running the Historical for 33.

P & S

At 09:46 PM 6/5/2013, Elaine Mami wrote:

>Jamie,
>This is exactly what I meant earlier: Attach yourself to Byron next
>year and you will learn a lot! Do the same at 33, because each MD
>has different ways to handle the same situations. It’s a good way to
>avoid silly mis-steps.
>Elaine
>
> > Jamie —
> >
> > Don’t you dare bail! We need new blood and we haven’t executed an
> MD yet! I ran the historicals at 24, 25, and 29 and am running the
> one at 32. I’ll be happy to work with you and I’m confident other
> historical MDs will be, too.
> >
> > See my comments on the historical in my response to Stace.
> >
> > Byron
> >
> > On Jun 5, 2013, at 3:49 PM, Jamie Butler
> <<mailto:utopianqueen2000%40yahoo.com>utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you for putting this out here stace. I honestly was too
> terrified to ask myself after judging in this year’s st masq. I was
> all set to be CC34’s historical masquerade director and after
> reading the emails and seeing how passionate everyone got about
> what a CC masquerade should be, I’ve questioned if I should all together.
> > >
> > > Jamie Butler
> > > President of Madison Area Costuming Society
> > > Member of the Guilde of St George

International Costumers’ Guild Archivist

http://www.costume.org/gallery2/main.php

“Those Who Fail to Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly –
Why They Are Simply Doomed.”

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C. Y. 4971

Andromeda

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Okay, you’ve all convinced me. Thank you though. I didn’t get all the emails for some reason so ill have to read through the responses to staces questions, but you all have made me feel much more confident about this. I won’t be able to shadow the Toronto masquerades because I have 1/2 finished costumes for them I’ve been planning for awhile now, but I would like to shadow the Charleston one. I meant to ask  you when I was at cc31, but then I started doubting my ability and held off. There are a few other icg run masquerades o can shadow inbetween now and cc34; but I was still wondering, if I still feel this way in a year or two, would anyone be willing to just be my background person, like an assistant while I’m freaking out about running my first masquerade?

I just am a new face to many of you, and i don’t want to be remembered as the girl who messed up the cc34 historical masquerade. I know that if I shadow and ask for help where it is needed that is very unlikely to happen, but I wouldnt mind having a friendly face there with me to remind me of things a director needs to do.

Jamie Butler
President of Madison Area Costuming Society
Member of the Guilde of St George

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thank you, Byron and Nora, your answers were the most helpful of all.

As I thought, logistically it isn’t any different from anything I’ve experienced. I even had already assumed that the tech was con-wide and as long as the concomm picked someone qualified to run the green rooms (like Byron~), that would not be for me to worry about.

I’m sure Jamie will appreciate the advice to help with historical – I won’t speak for her, though.

Anyone who has seen me blather ad nauseum on forums like cosplay.com about masquerade standards knows I’m a proponent of the ICG guidelines and adhere to them pretty closely. I’ve always judged under that system and assisted in the green room at cons that use something pretty close as well. So, judging standards, awards, and the belief in “merit deserves reward” are things I had already planned to have in place.

When I’m less burned-out, I’m also planning to ask Sheila if I can shadow her at an upcoming Archon.

Keep the opinions coming if you have them!

Stace

— In runacc@yahoogroups.com, Byron Connell <byronpconnell@…> wrote:
>
> The historical masquerade, on the other hand, is rather different. I’ve run three of them and am running the next one. First, it’s the only one. Regional SF cons and worldcons may permit historical entries in their SF masquerades; however, those entries usually don’t really fit the masquerade’s theme or purpose. At CCs, the historical is the historical is the historical., It differs not only in topic but also in the approach the entrants take. While there are some who believe “historical” ought to be pronounced “hysterical” (I am one of them), humor is rare in historical entries (but see “The Battle of the Bulge” at CC 17: http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3636&g2_page=2), group entries are less often seen, and the typical entry is one entrant presenting one recreation of a period garment.
>
> In addition, the historical requires the entrants to prepare documentation in support of their entries and requires the judges to review and judge the documentation. In addition, every entrant is required to meet with the judges to review his or her workmanship, for mandatory judging (unlike the voluntary workmanship judging in an SF masquerade. This takes a huge amount of time for the judges, who usually are unable to do anything else on Sunday — and maybe Saturday, depending on how large the show becomes. The MD needs to manage the schedule to some extent and check periodically that the judging is reasonably on schedule (it often is not). As a result, the judges normally make awards in three independent categories: documentation, workmanship, and presentation on stage and it’s not unknown for the total of awards across the three categories to exceed the total of entries (even though some entries receive no awards).
>
> Unlike for SF masquerades, the MD’s information and rules also must address the requirements for documentation as well as other aspects of the competition. See my info for the CC 32 historical as one example (http://costumecon32.com/programming-2014/competitions-events/historical-masquerade/). The Costume-Con web site (http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php) includes other sets of rules.

Oh I definitely appreciate the advice. The more I read the responses everyone had posted, the more I feel better about running my own. Fear for me comes from the unknown, I get freaked out when I think I need to do something without knowing what to do. As 31 was my first costume con ever (even though I tried to make previous ones but failed due to lack of money), I went, had a great but exhausting time, met costume con “celebritires”, people who’s names and costumes I’ve come across online but have never met in person, and then cane home and freaked out about impressing these people. I don’t know how many times I casually chatted with someone at cc31, then walked away back to my friends to have them say, “Jamie, do you realize who you were talking to..?”. Not to mention I fan-girled all over Margo Anderson. And geeked out after I met Phil.

So yes, please keep the suggestions coming. I won’t get offended if you tell me how you do it, because I just want to do it right.

Jamie Butler
President of Madison Area Costuming Society
Member of the Guilde of St George

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jamie —

I’m glad you’re feeling better about this. You definitely need an assistant director to spread the detail work. In Toronto, for example, Sylvain St.Pierre is my Assistant MD; that was the job he had at Anticipation, too. You may also want a personal assistant/gopher to help you stay sane.

Even if you can’t shadow me during tech rehearsal, visits to the judges, and the masquerade itself in Toronto, you certainly will be welcome at the Historical’s registration desk and to talk with me about what I may be doing and why. Pierre and Sandy Pettinger are running the CC 33 Historcal. I;m sure that they will be happy to have you shadow them.

Look at my contestant info on the CC 32 web site and at other historical masquerade rules at the Costume-Con web site: http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php. (Not every CC has the rules posted; you’ll have to browse through them.)

Don’t forget to ask us questions and raise ideas. We all love helping.

Byron

On Jun 6, 2013, at 11:12 AM, Jamie Butler <utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Okay, you’ve all convinced me. Thank you though. I didn’t get all the emails for some reason so ill have to read through the responses to staces questions, but you all have made me feel much more confident about this. I won’t be able to shadow the Toronto masquerades because I have 1/2 finished costumes for them I’ve been planning for awhile now, but I would like to shadow the Charleston one. I meant to ask you when I was at cc31, but then I started doubting my ability and held off. There are a few other icg run masquerades o can shadow inbetween now and cc34; but I was still wondering, if I still feel this way in a year or two, would anyone be willing to just be my background person, like an assistant while I’m freaking out about running my first masquerade?
>
> I just am a new face to many of you, and i don’t want to be remembered as the girl who messed up the cc34 historical masquerade. I know that if I shadow and ask for help where it is needed that is very unlikely to happen, but I wouldnt mind having a friendly face there with me to remind me of things a director needs to do.
>
> Jamie Butler
> President of Madison Area Costuming Society
> Member of the Guilde of St George
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

One of our traditions is that costumers who usually enter in the master division help run masquerades when they’re not entering. I’ve more than once heard someone ask a novice, “Do you know who your den mom is?!”

Byron

On Jun 6, 2013, at 1:42 PM, “staceylee25” <staceylee25@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Thank you, Byron and Nora, your answers were the most helpful of all.
>
> As I thought, logistically it isn’t any different from anything I’ve experienced. I even had already assumed that the tech was con-wide and as long as the concomm picked someone qualified to run the green rooms (like Byron~), that would not be for me to worry about.
>
> I’m sure Jamie will appreciate the advice to help with historical – I won’t speak for her, though.
>
> Anyone who has seen me blather ad nauseum on forums like cosplay.com about masquerade standards knows I’m a proponent of the ICG guidelines and adhere to them pretty closely. I’ve always judged under that system and assisted in the green room at cons that use something pretty close as well. So, judging standards, awards, and the belief in “merit deserves reward” are things I had already planned to have in place.
>
> When I’m less burned-out, I’m also planning to ask Sheila if I can shadow her at an upcoming Archon.
>
> Keep the opinions coming if you have them!
>
> Stace
>
> — In runacc@yahoogroups.com, Byron Connell <byronpconnell@…> wrote:
> >
> > The historical masquerade, on the other hand, is rather different. I’ve run three of them and am running the next one. First, it’s the only one. Regional SF cons and worldcons may permit historical entries in their SF masquerades; however, those entries usually don’t really fit the masquerade’s theme or purpose. At CCs, the historical is the historical is the historical., It differs not only in topic but also in the approach the entrants take. While there are some who believe “historical” ought to be pronounced “hysterical” (I am one of them), humor is rare in historical entries (but see “The Battle of the Bulge” at CC 17: http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3636&g2_page=2), group entries are less often seen, and the typical entry is one entrant presenting one recreation of a period garment.
> >
> > In addition, the historical requires the entrants to prepare documentation in support of their entries and requires the judges to review and judge the documentation. In addition, every entrant is required to meet with the judges to review his or her workmanship, for mandatory judging (unlike the voluntary workmanship judging in an SF masquerade. This takes a huge amount of time for the judges, who usually are unable to do anything else on Sunday — and maybe Saturday, depending on how large the show becomes. The MD needs to manage the schedule to some extent and check periodically that the judging is reasonably on schedule (it often is not). As a result, the judges normally make awards in three independent categories: documentation, workmanship, and presentation on stage and it’s not unknown for the total of awards across the three categories to exceed the total of entries (even though some entries receive no awards).
> >
> > Unlike for SF masquerades, the MD’s information and rules also must address the requirements for documentation as well as other aspects of the competition. See my info for the CC 32 historical as one example (http://costumecon32.com/programming-2014/competitions-events/historical-masquerade/). The Costume-Con web site (http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php) includes other sets of rules.
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

If you do feel panicked in a year or two, remember 2 things:first – it happens to all of us!second – just ask, and I know you will have plenty of volunteersmaybe even me.
Elainewho has a bad case of helium hand

Okay, you’ve all convinced me. Thank you though. I didn’t get all the emails for some reason so ill have to read through the responses to staces questions, but you all have made me feel much more confident about this. I won’t be able to shadow the Toronto masquerades because I have 1/2 finished costumes for them I’ve been planning for awhile now, but I would like to shadow the Charleston one. I meant to ask you when I was at cc31, but then I started doubting my ability and held off. There are a few other icg run masquerades o can shadow inbetween now and cc34; but I was still wondering, if I still feel this way in a year or two, would anyone be willing to just be my background person, like an assistant while I’m freaking out about running my first masquerade?

I just am a new face to many of you, and i don’t want to be remembered as the girl who messed up the cc34 historical masquerade. I know that if I shadow and ask for help where it is needed that is very unlikely to happen, but I wouldnt mind having a friendly face there with me to remind me of things a director needs to do.

Jamie Butler

President of Madison Area Costuming Society

Member of the Guilde of St George

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

At 07:15 PM 6/6/2013, you wrote:

>Jamie —
>
>I’m glad you’re feeling better about this. You definitely need an
>assistant director to spread the detail work. In Toronto, for
>example, Sylvain St.Pierre is my Assistant MD; that was the job he
>had at Anticipation, too. You may also want a personal
>assistant/gopher to help you stay sane.
>
>Even if you can’t shadow me during tech rehearsal, visits to the
>judges, and the masquerade itself in Toronto, you certainly will be
>welcome at the Historical’s registration desk and to talk with me
>about what I may be doing and why. Pierre and Sandy Pettinger are
>running the CC 33 Historcal. I;m sure that they will be happy to
>have you shadow them.

You’d be very welcome.

Pierre and Sandy

>Look at my contestant info on the CC 32 web site and at other
>historical masquerade rules at the Costume-Con web site:
>http://www.costume-con.org/gallery2/main.php. (Not every CC has the
>rules posted; you’ll have to browse through them.)
>
>Don’t forget to ask us questions and raise ideas. We all love helping.
>
>Byron
>
>On Jun 6, 2013, at 11:12 AM, Jamie Butler <utopianqueen2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Okay, you’ve all convinced me. Thank you though. I didn’t get all
> the emails for some reason so ill have to read through the
> responses to staces questions, but you all have made me feel much
> more confident about this. I won’t be able to shadow the Toronto
> masquerades because I have 1/2 finished costumes for them I’ve been
> planning for awhile now, but I would like to shadow the Charleston
> one. I meant to ask you when I was at cc31, but then I started
> doubting my ability and held off. There are a few other icg run
> masquerades o can shadow inbetween now and cc34; but I was still
> wondering, if I still feel this way in a year or two, would anyone
> be willing to just be my background person, like an assistant while
> I’m freaking out about running my first masquerade?
> >
> > I just am a new face to many of you, and i don’t want to be
> remembered as the girl who messed up the cc34 historical
> masquerade. I know that if I shadow and ask for help where it is
> needed that is very unlikely to happen, but I wouldnt mind having a
> friendly face there with me to remind me of things a director needs to do.
> >
> > Jamie Butler
> > President of Madison Area Costuming Society
> > Member of the Guilde of St George

International Costumers’ Guild Archivist

http://www.costume.org/gallery2/main.php

“Those Who Fail to Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly –
Why They Are Simply Doomed.”

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C. Y. 4971

Andromeda

On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:36 PM, staceylee25 <staceylee25@yahoo.com> wrote:

> But given the foibles seen at CC31, which I’m also not going to review
> just now, there has been a lot of talk of “but CC is different!”

Well… (late to the party)

Costume-Con is different, because the masquerades are the focus of the
convention, not just something that happens at them.

As MD at a Costume-Con, you should get the better support from the con
chair and committee than any other convention could be bothered to give
you. You should have Program (or scheduling) giving you priority for
competition-related space and time slots. You should get better volunteers
helping you run your masquerade, because that’s what the people who aren’t
there to enter are likely there for. You should have a great pool of people
to choose great judges from. You should have amazingly prepared entrants
ready to wow the audience.

They’re all “shoulds” but they’re usually true. I ran a great F&SF at CC21,
but that’s only because I had a great crew, wonderful judges, an amazing
slate of entrants, a killer hotel negotiator fixing problems at the last
minute and an assistant director who made me look very good.

I’m not saying that there aren’t other great conventions with traditions of
supporting costuming and costume competition, because there are. But at no
other convention will you find a membership with the depth and breadth of
experience in supporting and running good shows.

andy

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi everyone,

I would like some information. I’ve got Marg from CC30 and Henry from CC29 and Dawn from CC32 sending me info that they have but I would appreciate a little more help with numbers. My financial support group needs me to prepare a “business proposal” that contains a budget, income/outcome expectations and hotel room night pickup figures. I’ve got an example from the local con on their budget but I would like to hear from CC31 what their room pickups were and CC28 so I can have 5 years of figures to pull from. Thank you for your help.

Also, there was someone who had a base contract for hotels. Would they mind forwarding it to me at Rebecca8175atgmaildotcom?

I was going to just come in and say something about coming late to the
discussion in answer to Stace’s question, but the more I read, the more
I figured that what I’m going to say here is not actually quite the same
thing. So this is more an adjunct topic to answer something that
hasn’t quite been asked yet.

Some of us (in the SLCG and others) have, on a number of occasions,
harped about some concoms having staffers who utter the infamous “At X
Con we…..”, and which often (not always) leads to repetitions of
mistakes that could have been avoid had some people had a better
understanding of the CC community So, I got to thinking about how CC
is different from a generral SF con, and so far, I came up with three
thoughts.

Costume-Con is a small con with a big-con feel. Part of that is due to
the fact that it’s a single interest conference – there’s
not a gaming sub-group, a video room, no anime sub-group, etc. It
draws people who are focused on learning their craft and exchanging
ideas with their peers. There’s a high amount of dedication
involved with having to travel to a different city for a CC. And
since CC has the cache of “International venue” status, it
tends to (for better or worse) filter out the people who aren’t
serious about their craft. If you think about it, there really
aren’t a lot of “casual” attendees.

Costume-Con’s community is sort of like a medium-sized town.
It’s small enough that everyone sort of recognizes each other, and
Nora sez there’s a diner (or bar like Cheers) where all the regulars
congregate. The town has an active tourist bureau, and some people
come to like it so much that they decide to stay.

Possibly the single biggest difference between CC and a general SF con
is there is an expectation of competency in the staff. As someone
mentioned earlier in the discussion, the depth of experience at this con
is like nowhere else. A lot of the attendees work or run their own
conventions and/or masquerades in some capacity. Not to mention, these
people have been coming to CC for years – so they’re more aware than
others about which CCs were good and which could have been better. The
same applies to programming.

So, not surprisingly, if there are organizational problems that could
have been avoided, people are going to notice. And talk about it.
That doesn’t mean that mistakes shouldn’t and won’t happen –
but it seems like some mistakes are unnecessarily repeated, despite the
availability of resources like the Runacc list.

I would urge future CC committees to discuss the above with the folks
they bring in who have never been to a CC.

Bruce

P.S. The SCCG review just wrapped up. I’ll have it out on this list
in the next few days, hopefully.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

A tiny note to add to this: the Yahoo Group archive will let newer
subscribers go back and look at comments from several previous CCs, as to
what was felt about both mistakes and things that went right. It may take a
bit of digging, but even if committees just make up a checklist of “this
worked and that didn’t” it could put them ahead of the game.

For that matter, at some point it could be useful to compile something
like that and publish it, not in the snotty sense of “this is what we say
you should be doing” but rather “this has worked well in the past, that
didn’t, and we’re trying to help you avoid some of the pitfalls.” It would
take some digging, but would be a worthwhile project. It could even
become a tool for those who are considering making a CC bid, so they’d know
what they’re getting into.

Tina

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

What Bruce says is generally true. I would add that there is a reason why
the “Con” in Costume-Con stands for Conference, not Convention. If you read
the ConStitution (and I encourage EVERYONE on this list to do so), you’ll
see that distinction right there.

While the city might change from year to year, the ConStitution was
designed to provide a basic structure under which each CC operates.

A very VERY long time ago, there was a point where I was working on a How
To document that outlined all the steps which went into creating CC16, but
I can’t find the files now – odds are excellent that I archived them when I
archived the rest of my CC.org files, so they’re on a CD somewhere in the
house and not on my hard disk anymore. I think my logic dictated that with
changes in costs over time, detailing the specifics like budget numbers
would require more maintenance than I could provide.

For whatever reason, the files are not in this group and I think they
should be. I will make an effort to figure out what I did with them and
will upload them to the group area.

I’m preparing for a house move (sigh, yes, again) and in the midst of a
fairly ugly work-related policy discussion, so don’t have enough spoons to
devote right now to this conversation, but I encourage everyone on this
list to take full advantage of its existence and hash this out.

The very good thing about Yahoo Groups, for as long as it lasts, is that it
provides an archive of discussion items. I could suggest using the CCXV
budget as a starting point for all the various aspects of running a CC, as
its layout includes not just the numbers but what we spent our money on. It
isn’t exhaustive, but its pretty close to.

More when I have a chance…

Betsy

On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Bruce <casamai@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
> I was going to just come in and say something about coming late to the
> discussion in answer to Stace’s question, but the more I read, the more
> I figured that what I’m going to say here is not actually quite the same
> thing. So this is more an adjunct topic to answer something that
> hasn’t quite been asked yet.
>
> Some of us (in the SLCG and others) have, on a number of occasions,
> harped about some concoms having staffers who utter the infamous “At X
> Con we…..”, and which often (not always) leads to repetitions of
> mistakes that could have been avoid had some people had a better
> understanding of the CC community So, I got to thinking about how CC
> is different from a generral SF con, and so far, I came up with three
> thoughts.
>
> Costume-Con is a small con with a big-con feel. Part of that is due to
> the fact that it’s a single interest conference � there’s
> not a gaming sub-group, a video room, no anime sub-group, etc. It
> draws people who are focused on learning their craft and exchanging
> ideas with their peers. There’s a high amount of dedication
> involved with having to travel to a different city for a CC. And
> since CC has the cache of “International venue” status, it
> tends to (for better or worse) filter out the people who aren’t
> serious about their craft. If you think about it, there really
> aren’t a lot of “casual” attendees.
>
> Costume-Con’s community is sort of like a medium-sized town.
> It’s small enough that everyone sort of recognizes each other, and
> Nora sez there’s a diner (or bar like Cheers) where all the regulars
> congregate. The town has an active tourist bureau, and some people
> come to like it so much that they decide to stay.
>
> Possibly the single biggest difference between CC and a general SF con
> is there is an expectation of competency in the staff. As someone
> mentioned earlier in the discussion, the depth of experience at this con
> is like nowhere else. A lot of the attendees work or run their own
> conventions and/or masquerades in some capacity. Not to mention, these
> people have been coming to CC for years – so they’re more aware than
> others about which CCs were good and which could have been better. The
> same applies to programming.
>
> So, not surprisingly, if there are organizational problems that could
> have been avoided, people are going to notice. And talk about it.
> That doesn’t mean that mistakes shouldn’t and won’t happen �
> but it seems like some mistakes are unnecessarily repeated, despite the
> availability of resources like the Runacc list.
>
> I would urge future CC committees to discuss the above with the folks
> they bring in who have never been to a CC.
>
> Bruce
>
> P.S. The SCCG review just wrapped up. I’ll have it out on this list
> in the next few days, hopefully.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> Groups Links
>
>
>
>

—
—
—
Betsy Marks Delaney

http://www.hawkeswood.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I know you include a number of sample files on the Constitution page
http://costume-con.org/constitution.shtml

On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 5:38 AM, Betsy Marks Delaney
<aramintamd@gmail.com>wrote:

> What Bruce says is generally true. I would add that there is a reason why
> the “Con” in Costume-Con stands for Conference, not Convention. If you read
> the ConStitution (and I encourage EVERYONE on this list to do so), you’ll
> see that distinction right there.
>
> While the city might change from year to year, the ConStitution was
> designed to provide a basic structure under which each CC operates.
>
> A very VERY long time ago, there was a point where I was working on a How
> To document that outlined all the steps which went into creating CC16, but
> I can’t find the files now – odds are excellent that I archived them when I
> archived the rest of my CC.org files, so they’re on a CD somewhere in the
> house and not on my hard disk anymore. I think my logic dictated that with
> changes in costs over time, detailing the specifics like budget numbers
> would require more maintenance than I could provide.
>
> For whatever reason, the files are not in this group and I think they
> should be. I will make an effort to figure out what I did with them and
> will upload them to the group area.
>
> I’m preparing for a house move (sigh, yes, again) and in the midst of a
> fairly ugly work-related policy discussion, so don’t have enough spoons to
> devote right now to this conversation, but I encourage everyone on this
> list to take full advantage of its existence and hash this out.
>
> The very good thing about Yahoo Groups, for as long as it lasts, is that it
> provides an archive of discussion items. I could suggest using the CCXV
> budget as a starting point for all the various aspects of running a CC, as
> its layout includes not just the numbers but what we spent our money on. It
> isn’t exhaustive, but its pretty close to.
>
> More when I have a chance…
>
> Betsy
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Bruce <casamai@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > I was going to just come in and say something about coming late to the
> > discussion in answer to Stace’s question, but the more I read, the more
> > I figured that what I’m going to say here is not actually quite the same
> > thing. So this is more an adjunct topic to answer something that
> > hasn’t quite been asked yet.
> >
> > Some of us (in the SLCG and others) have, on a number of occasions,
> > harped about some concoms having staffers who utter the infamous “At X
> > Con we…..”, and which often (not always) leads to repetitions of
> > mistakes that could have been avoid had some people had a better
> > understanding of the CC community So, I got to thinking about how CC
> > is different from a generral SF con, and so far, I came up with three
> > thoughts.
> >
> > Costume-Con is a small con with a big-con feel. Part of that is due to
> > the fact that it’s a single interest conference � there’s
> > not a gaming sub-group, a video room, no anime sub-group, etc. It
> > draws people who are focused on learning their craft and exchanging
> > ideas with their peers. There’s a high amount of dedication
> > involved with having to travel to a different city for a CC. And
> > since CC has the cache of “International venue” status, it
> > tends to (for better or worse) filter out the people who aren’t
> > serious about their craft. If you think about it, there really
> > aren’t a lot of “casual” attendees.
> >
> > Costume-Con’s community is sort of like a medium-sized town.
> > It’s small enough that everyone sort of recognizes each other, and
> > Nora sez there’s a diner (or bar like Cheers) where all the regulars
> > congregate. The town has an active tourist bureau, and some people
> > come to like it so much that they decide to stay.
> >
> > Possibly the single biggest difference between CC and a general SF con
> > is there is an expectation of competency in the staff. As someone
> > mentioned earlier in the discussion, the depth of experience at this con
> > is like nowhere else. A lot of the attendees work or run their own
> > conventions and/or masquerades in some capacity. Not to mention, these
> > people have been coming to CC for years – so they’re more aware than
> > others about which CCs were good and which could have been better. The
> > same applies to programming.
> >
> > So, not surprisingly, if there are organizational problems that could
> > have been avoided, people are going to notice. And talk about it.
> > That doesn’t mean that mistakes shouldn’t and won’t happen �
> > but it seems like some mistakes are unnecessarily repeated, despite the
> > availability of resources like the Runacc list.
> >
> > I would urge future CC committees to discuss the above with the folks
> > they bring in who have never been to a CC.
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> > P.S. The SCCG review just wrapped up. I’ll have it out on this list
> > in the next few days, hopefully.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ————————————
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> > Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> —
> —
> —
> Betsy Marks Delaney
>
> http://www.hawkeswood.com/
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> Groups Links
>
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Actually, Tina, NOTHING really prepares you!

Elaine

CC 30’s Recliner

A tiny note to add to this: the Yahoo Group archive will let newer
subscribers go back and look at comments from several previous CCs, as to
what was felt about both mistakes and things that went right. It may take a
bit of digging, but even if committees just make up a checklist of “this
worked and that didn’t” it could put them ahead of the game.

For that matter, at some point it could be useful to compile something
like that and publish it, not in the snotty sense of “this is what we say
you should be doing” but rather “this has worked well in the past, that
didn’t, and we’re trying to help you avoid some of the pitfalls.” It would
take some digging, but would be a worthwhile project. It could even
become a tool for those who are considering making a CC bid, so they’d know
what they’re getting into.

Tina

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ah. Well, that answers that question. I’d wondered what happened to
those notes. Hopefully, you’ll find them. We probably still have them,
too, but Lord knows where. A lot of the notes are still relevant, even 15
years later.

Bruce

—–Original Message—–
From: runacc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:runacc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Betsy Marks Delaney
Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 7:39 AM
To: List, Run a CC
Subject: Re: [runacc] “Costume-Con is different”

What Bruce says is generally true. I would add that there is a reason why
the “Con” in Costume-Con stands for Conference, not Convention. If you read
the ConStitution (and I encourage EVERYONE on this list to do so), you’ll
see that distinction right there.

While the city might change from year to year, the ConStitution was
designed to provide a basic structure under which each CC operates.

A very VERY long time ago, there was a point where I was working on a How
To document that outlined all the steps which went into creating CC16, but
I can’t find the files now – odds are excellent that I archived them when I
archived the rest of my CC.org files, so they’re on a CD somewhere in the
house and not on my hard disk anymore. I think my logic dictated that with
changes in costs over time, detailing the specifics like budget numbers
would require more maintenance than I could provide.

For whatever reason, the files are not in this group and I think they
should be. I will make an effort to figure out what I did with them and
will upload them to the group area.

I’m preparing for a house move (sigh, yes, again) and in the midst of a
fairly ugly work-related policy discussion, so don’t have enough spoons to
devote right now to this conversation, but I encourage everyone on this
list to take full advantage of its existence and hash this out.

The very good thing about Yahoo Groups, for as long as it lasts, is that it
provides an archive of discussion items. I could suggest using the CCXV
budget as a starting point for all the various aspects of running a CC, as
its layout includes not just the numbers but what we spent our money on. It
isn’t exhaustive, but its pretty close to.

More when I have a chance…

Betsy

On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Bruce <casamai@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
> I was going to just come in and say something about coming late to the
> discussion in answer to Stace’s question, but the more I read, the more
> I figured that what I’m going to say here is not actually quite the same
> thing. So this is more an adjunct topic to answer something that
> hasn’t quite been asked yet.
>
> Some of us (in the SLCG and others) have, on a number of occasions,
> harped about some concoms having staffers who utter the infamous “At X
> Con we…..”, and which often (not always) leads to repetitions of
> mistakes that could have been avoid had some people had a better
> understanding of the CC community So, I got to thinking about how CC
> is different from a generral SF con, and so far, I came up with three
> thoughts.
>
> Costume-Con is a small con with a big-con feel. Part of that is due to
> the fact that it’s a single interest conference – there’s
> not a gaming sub-group, a video room, no anime sub-group, etc. It
> draws people who are focused on learning their craft and exchanging
> ideas with their peers. There’s a high amount of dedication
> involved with having to travel to a different city for a CC. And
> since CC has the cache of “International venue” status, it
> tends to (for better or worse) filter out the people who aren’t
> serious about their craft. If you think about it, there really
> aren’t a lot of “casual” attendees.
>
> Costume-Con’s community is sort of like a medium-sized town.
> It’s small enough that everyone sort of recognizes each other, and
> Nora sez there’s a diner (or bar like Cheers) where all the regulars
> congregate. The town has an active tourist bureau, and some people
> come to like it so much that they decide to stay.
>
> Possibly the single biggest difference between CC and a general SF con
> is there is an expectation of competency in the staff. As someone
> mentioned earlier in the discussion, the depth of experience at this con
> is like nowhere else. A lot of the attendees work or run their own
> conventions and/or masquerades in some capacity. Not to mention, these
> people have been coming to CC for years – so they’re more aware than
> others about which CCs were good and which could have been better. The
> same applies to programming.
>
> So, not surprisingly, if there are organizational problems that could
> have been avoided, people are going to notice. And talk about it.
> That doesn’t mean that mistakes shouldn’t and won’t happen –
> but it seems like some mistakes are unnecessarily repeated, despite the
> availability of resources like the Runacc list.
>
> I would urge future CC committees to discuss the above with the folks
> they bring in who have never been to a CC.
>
> Bruce
>
> P.S. The SCCG review just wrapped up. I’ll have it out on this list
> in the next few days, hopefully.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> Groups Links
>
>
>
>

—
—
—
Betsy Marks Delaney

http://www.hawkeswood.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

————————————

View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo! Groups
Links

—–
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG – www.avg.com
Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6435 – Release Date: 06/23/13

—–
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG – www.avg.com
Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6435 – Release Date: 06/23/13

I agree, based on the questions (and answers). I will give it a shot to
find them before I leave for Pennsic, but it may take some doing. OTOH, if
it waits till after I move…

Betsy

On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 9:16 PM, Nora & Bruce Mai <casamai@sbcglobal.net>wrote:

> Ah. Well, that answers that question. I’d wondered what happened to
> those notes. Hopefully, you’ll find them. We probably still have them,
> too, but Lord knows where. A lot of the notes are still relevant, even 15
> years later.
>
> Bruce
>
> —–Original Message—–
> From: runacc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:runacc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
> Betsy Marks Delaney
> Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 7:39 AM
> To: List, Run a CC
> Subject: Re: [runacc] “Costume-Con is different”
>
> What Bruce says is generally true. I would add that there is a reason why
> the “Con” in Costume-Con stands for Conference, not Convention. If you read
> the ConStitution (and I encourage EVERYONE on this list to do so), you’ll
> see that distinction right there.
>
> While the city might change from year to year, the ConStitution was
> designed to provide a basic structure under which each CC operates.
>
> A very VERY long time ago, there was a point where I was working on a How
> To document that outlined all the steps which went into creating CC16, but
> I can’t find the files now – odds are excellent that I archived them when I
> archived the rest of my CC.org files, so they’re on a CD somewhere in the
> house and not on my hard disk anymore. I think my logic dictated that with
> changes in costs over time, detailing the specifics like budget numbers
> would require more maintenance than I could provide.
>
> For whatever reason, the files are not in this group and I think they
> should be. I will make an effort to figure out what I did with them and
> will upload them to the group area.
>
> I’m preparing for a house move (sigh, yes, again) and in the midst of a
> fairly ugly work-related policy discussion, so don’t have enough spoons to
> devote right now to this conversation, but I encourage everyone on this
> list to take full advantage of its existence and hash this out.
>
> The very good thing about Yahoo Groups, for as long as it lasts, is that it
> provides an archive of discussion items. I could suggest using the CCXV
> budget as a starting point for all the various aspects of running a CC, as
> its layout includes not just the numbers but what we spent our money on. It
> isn’t exhaustive, but its pretty close to.
>
> More when I have a chance…
>
> Betsy
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Bruce <casamai@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > I was going to just come in and say something about coming late to the
> > discussion in answer to Stace’s question, but the more I read, the more
> > I figured that what I’m going to say here is not actually quite the same
> > thing. So this is more an adjunct topic to answer something that
> > hasn’t quite been asked yet.
> >
> > Some of us (in the SLCG and others) have, on a number of occasions,
> > harped about some concoms having staffers who utter the infamous “At X
> > Con we…..”, and which often (not always) leads to repetitions of
> > mistakes that could have been avoid had some people had a better
> > understanding of the CC community So, I got to thinking about how CC
> > is different from a generral SF con, and so far, I came up with three
> > thoughts.
> >
> > Costume-Con is a small con with a big-con feel. Part of that is due to
> > the fact that it’s a single interest conference – there’s
> > not a gaming sub-group, a video room, no anime sub-group, etc. It
> > draws people who are focused on learning their craft and exchanging
> > ideas with their peers. There’s a high amount of dedication
> > involved with having to travel to a different city for a CC. And
> > since CC has the cache of “International venue” status, it
> > tends to (for better or worse) filter out the people who aren’t
> > serious about their craft. If you think about it, there really
> > aren’t a lot of “casual” attendees.
> >
> > Costume-Con’s community is sort of like a medium-sized town.
> > It’s small enough that everyone sort of recognizes each other, and
> > Nora sez there’s a diner (or bar like Cheers) where all the regulars
> > congregate. The town has an active tourist bureau, and some people
> > come to like it so much that they decide to stay.
> >
> > Possibly the single biggest difference between CC and a general SF con
> > is there is an expectation of competency in the staff. As someone
> > mentioned earlier in the discussion, the depth of experience at this con
> > is like nowhere else. A lot of the attendees work or run their own
> > conventions and/or masquerades in some capacity. Not to mention, these
> > people have been coming to CC for years – so they’re more aware than
> > others about which CCs were good and which could have been better. The
> > same applies to programming.
> >
> > So, not surprisingly, if there are organizational problems that could
> > have been avoided, people are going to notice. And talk about it.
> > That doesn’t mean that mistakes shouldn’t and won’t happen –
> > but it seems like some mistakes are unnecessarily repeated, despite the
> > availability of resources like the Runacc list.
> >
> > I would urge future CC committees to discuss the above with the folks
> > they bring in who have never been to a CC.
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> > P.S. The SCCG review just wrapped up. I’ll have it out on this list
> > in the next few days, hopefully.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ————————————
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> > Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> —
> —
> —
> Betsy Marks Delaney
>
> http://www.hawkeswood.com/
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> Groups
> Links
>
>
>
>
>
> —–
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG – www.avg.com
> Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6435 – Release Date: 06/23/13
>
>
> —–
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG – www.avg.com
> Version: 2013.0.3345 / Virus Database: 3199/6435 – Release Date: 06/23/13
>
>
>
> ————————————
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/Yahoo!
> Groups Links
>
>
>
>

—
—
—
Betsy Marks Delaney

http://www.hawkeswood.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Okay, as promised, here’s the SLCG review of CC31.

I’m handling this one a little differently this time, for 2 reasons.
First, 2 of the 3 standing CC committee heads are members of the SLCG
and already have seen the full-length version with everyone’s
comments back and forth. Second, this review is somewhat edited for
content about what future committees can have control over, and not what
they won’t. That means there won’t, for the most part, be any
airing of individual complaints unless there was a trend noticed by
everyone who attended. (By the way, this year’s review was compiled
from comments by at least 8 members)

Before the con

The Folio:

While the Folio came out in a reasonable amount of time before the
convention, there appeared to be an unnecessarily long gap between the
submission deadline and when they were mailed out. Word is this had
something to do with the Folio Director trying to corral the judges into
one place to get the work done. And then, there was a problem with
production, where the Con Chair wound up doing the layout.

Recommendation: The Folio Director needs to be reliable – so do the
judges, so get assurances of availability from them. It might be
better if they’re all local – having them spread out may become
a problem.

Regular participants in the Folio said the Folio was….uninspiring.
The designs were very wearable – not so much “costumey”.
Unfortunately, that also meant they weren’t very interesting to look
at. The fact that the designs were organized by creator’s names
also made the Folio less interesting to browse (although, it certainly
made it easier to find someone). At least there were a lot of new
designers this year, rather than just the same people.

Recommendation: Come up with more categories that inspire people.
Sometimes a theme in a Folio can be a good thing, but it can also
backfire, because then designers feel restricted. Maybe promote the
idea of sponsored categories (although this can get out of hand, so you
have to watch it)

Communication: We were a bit put off by some staffers using secure
email accounts associated with the addresses off the convention website.
This meant that when you sent them a message, you got a
“CAPTCHA” response where you had to type a code in to permit
your email to reach them. If these staffers were concerned about
their private email, they should have set up another account just for CC
matters. There were one or two people on staff who were not very
prompt in answering their emails, but otherwise, the convention gets
points for communication regarding the Progress Reports. We liked that
there were were 4 PRs, but the last one that came out the week of the
convention, when some people were already en route.

Recommendation: Make sure that major staff positions have email
addresses where they can easily be reached.

Some information channels were neglected – there was barely any
activity on the CC Yahoo list, nor was there much in the way of
participation on the Cosplay.com forum. These were missed opportunities
for promotion and information dissemination.

Recommendation: If you want to have maximum exposure, you should have
someone whose major responsibility is Communications. DO NOT make it
an additional duty for someone who already has an important job, because
communications will not be given as much priority – it’s just
human nature. Make sure all the info put out gets to all the various
forums (CC, ICG-D, Cosplay.com, F-Costume, etc.) – not just Facebook.
Maybe even change the content from one forum to another – swap stuff
around – make it more interesting to people who read more than one
of the above.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The Hotel:

First things first – free parking. Thank you.

Opinions about the hotel were all over the map, including some rooms
having problems, location to food, etc. The main complaint was about
the hotel staff, described as “bi-polar” – some were fine,
but some were just ridiculous. The bar/restaurant in the lobby was
incredibly slow. But we appreciated the relatively reasonably priced
breakfast buffet each day.

Recommendation: Knowing you have to pay more money beyond the hotel
room (and hotel food, possibly) can really stick in one’s craw. So
if there’s going to be a cost each day for parking, make sure people
know about it way ahead of time so they can budget for it. When we
wrote up our experiences from CC16, one thing we recommendeded was
choosing a hotel in a business district – we think it’s still
good advice. People are less likely to appreciate “atmosphere”
when it drags on their pocketbook. And we’ve never been fans of
hotels in a downtown district for that reason. Having a hotel with
nearby restaurants is an important consideration. People shouldn’t
have to travel too far afield to find a meal beyond fast food.

And can we please have a hotel that has a pool and hot tub that works
and is open?

Registration:

Good marks for being able to at least hand out some membership stuff on
Thursday, and having a goodie bag with useful stuff was a welcome change
from past years. The registration people, which was at least mostly
staff by locals, were efficient and friendly. The only major complaints
we had was about the printing of the membership badges – they were
not legible. The print was too small and the background was too dark.

We liked the “Pocket Program”, which consisted of three stapled
sheets. Someone gave this some thought – it had the dealers room
hours, the Con Suite Hours and a map of the hotel. The only thing we
would have liked to have seen added was the sponsorships for the Con
Suite.

Recommendations: Make sure your membership badges are readable, with
large print and a light background. Having a membership packet with
free stuff gives the con-goer a feeling of value. Work with local
businesses to include coupons, etc.

There was a suggestion that maybe there should be an CC information
table next to Registration, manned by a CC Veteran.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Programming

The 9:30 start for programming each day was a little later than
we’re used to, but honestly, that did give us a little more time to
eat, get in costume & prepare for panels. The 90 minute time slots
worked and gave people more time to do a panel and discuss stuff. Not
everyone used all of that time, which was good.

Six tracks (4 plus the Green Room & Main Ballroom) appeared to be
sufficient for all the panels. Our perception was there was a better
selection of subjects that were actually worth trying to see – stuff
that you don’t see often (moulage & lattice smocking for instance).
Almost all of them were well attended, including the GOH. Byron
expressed that there was not enough for non-costumers like him to do,
which brings up a valid point that not everyone in our community makes
costumes, so program directors should keep this in mind. There were
the usual complaints that people were forced to decide between panels
that were scheduled opposite each other.

Recommendation: Consider using the 90 minute panel slot format.
We’ve heard complaints in the past that there not enough “hands
on” classes at previous CCs, but there should be a balance of
workshops, panels and lectures so that CC is enjoyable for everyone.
The panels that do appeal to non-costumers should include handouts and
other visual aids so that it’s not just a “talking head” lecture.
Younger people have less tolerance for that.

It’s been suggested before that maybe there should be some repeated
panels for those who missed a program earlier in the weekend.
Something to consider.

There needs to be one – possibly two – “My First
Costume-Con” panels – on Friday and Saturday, at every CC for all
the newbies who arrive each day. Nora and I would be willing to run
these.

Exhibits/Dolls

A good display of local costumes, plenty of room and plenty of room to
look at them. Having the dolls in the exhibits room was a good idea,
because it drove traffic to the display and security could keep an eye
on both.

Dealers Room

It had some interesting stuff, but there were also disappointments. No
book dealer? Word is Janet was supposed to be there. The Patterns
of Time table was not nearly as well stocked as would have been thought,
since Denver is their home base. There should have been many, many
more patterns for sale. The one trim dealer was reasonably priced.
From what we can tell, the dealers all seemed to be doing well.

Con Suite
The Con Suite got pretty good marks for keeping things stocked with the
basics like sodas, a few chips. We were spoiled by CC30’s Con
Suite where we just paid money and they took care of it. It was nice
to see several groups sponsoring food events. We were a little put off
by some of the restrictions by the Con Suite person – 2 hour slots,
you have to do all the work, no cooking in the room, no refrigerator,
etc.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It went relatively well and, generally, everyone liked the more informal
format. That’s about all we can say about it. We did wonder
about why the Green Room was used as the venue for the FNS, and the
ballroom for the masquerades was used as the “Green Room”.
Byron’s comments regarding particulars of the room pretty much
covered everything else.. The food for the event was pretty good,
however, there was a potential for disaster with the spicy glazed
chicken wings. Having the food on the opposite end of the room from
the entry point was a good idea, so that there was no choke point.
This was probably just a practical matter, since the kitchen was located
on that side of the room.

The MC for all the shows got good marks for being respectful, being easy
to work with and he tried to learn about our community so he could make
remarks and jokes later.

Recommendation: Having the food on the opposite end of the room from
the entry point was a good idea, so that there was no choke point at the
entrance. Think carefully about any foods served where stuff could
easily drip on a costume.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

As you are aware, this came in for the most criticism. Much discussion
has occurred elsewhere, so we’re not going to dwell on certain
aspects regarding the awards. Suffice to say, you knew there was a
problem when you had people you barely knew come up and ask your opinion
about whether there were enough awards given out.

The Green Room had a number of problems. Much of it had to do with
organization. There were issues with check in, not having den tables
set up in time, the Green Room Manager’s demeanor, the lack of
clearly identifying who the GRM & Den Moms were, and not ushering
entrants to Official Photography and Workmanship Judging.

The LED stage lights were very harsh, judging by the masquerade videos.
They were either too close or not diffuse enough.

Recommendations: The MD should tell people when to arrive in the Green
Room when they register, not just rely on them to read their paperwork.
If you’re making use of a local person for Green Room, make sure
your GRM has good people skills. Make sure the den moms know they need
to stay near their assigned table. Even if there is only going to be
water backstage, make sure there are straws for people with masks.

Even if the Green Room is just a ways down the hall, have seating
available for people waiting in awkward costumes is a good idea.
Backstage crews should have flashlights to help light people’s way
as they come off stage.

There should be separate panels of judges for Presentation and
Workmanship. You know the reasons why.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Future Fashion Show

We were glad to see the Director allowed for more than one person to
make up a design, which was good – you’re more likely to get
people to participate that way. The one drawback to the show observed
was not having those same designs come out at the same time – that
way, the audience can compare how the same design was interpreted. The
judges seemed competent, and they were different than the usual people
who might get tapped to judge, so that was good – we can use new
blood.

Recommendation: Keep allowing more than one person to make up designs.

Historical Masquerade:

Generally, it was well run, with a few annoying slips. The MD
didn’t have enough entry forms available for sign up at the con.
Like the SF masq director, entrants weren’t verbally told what time
to show up for the Green Room. Also, the MD allowed a few last-minute
walk in registrations after the supposed “deadline time”, much
to the frustration of the judges who had already begun deliberations.
Finally, the MD held up the awards being handed out because they wanted
to print the certificates with the names of the winners, rather than
just having them written by hand. (At least, there was no shortage of
awards for this show) Other than that, the MD was pleasant to work
with and attentive.

The same Green Room problems occurred for this masquerade, although not
quite as pronounced.

Recommendation: Don’t allow people to sign up after your
registration deadline – it sets a bad precedent. If someone can’t
get themselves organized to get registered on time, they should suffer
the consequences.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The Official Photographer:

We liked him. He was creative, making suggestions for poses, and had
fun doing his job. His quality of work was good and prices were
reasonable. He also made an effort to take some photos of other
activities during the con. Not all official photographers get around to
this.

Recommendation: We need to find more people like this guy. There’s a
possibility he might be interested in coming to more CCs (depending on
location – Madison?)

There was very little “At MileHighCon, we….”, which was
refreshing to NOT hear from the con staff)

Guests of Honor:

There was some concern expressed about the trend of having a Guest of
Honor. Some of our people askied about how much compensation there
was/has been. They wondered about how things might appear if peers are
getting some of their expenses paid when everyone else is paying their
memberships. That doesn’t mean there shouldn’t be programming
featuring someone in our community – the service mark holder (Karen)
expressed disappointment that there were no retrospectives. Given the
number of talented people in our community, we could, theoretically,
have at least one every year. (And while I hesitate to mention this,
there could come a time when the Archives could aid in providing
material when necessary.

Speaking of the Archives, it was nice to hear people applauding for
those in this year’s video memoriam (even when they clearly
didn’t know who the featured costumers were). The audience also
enjoyed the video recognizing CC veterans (and the veterans got a kick
out of being recognized). With more material being brought to CCs (and
online), people are starting to become more aware of each other in our
community, and that’s a good thing.

Overall, Mike gets a thumbs up for running a pretty good non-coastal CC.
We gave CC31 a B to B+.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Looks like Joni Dashoff’s email’s been hacked.

Bruce

 

 

Sorry very old desktop running Windows Xp which they stopped supporting
this month. I have a new laptop on order (so I can  take those pesky CC33
memberships) and I’m switching to my gmail account as soon as I find my info.
Joni

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

——– Original message ——–
From: “‘Nora & Bruce Mai’ casamai@sbcglobal.net [runacc]”
Date:05/26/2014 3:00 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [runacc] Invites

 

Reply via web post

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Messages in this topic (3)

 

Yes, please.  San Diego is Rebecca Rowan & me.

Thanks,

Elaine

rebecca8175@gmail.com

I’ve been on the list for several years.  I’ve also asked for info for various things while lurking too.

 

 

 

 

 

And the head of the bid, and now con treasurer for CC35 is Mark
Tjan:

office@markptjan.com

Pierre

At 08:03 PM 5/26/2014, you wrote:

 

Natalie Wallce is the newest
elected con chair

easiest to reach her at:
n.wallace@conbravo.com

and I will tell her the invite is coming
Gravely MacCabre

http://www.castleblood.com

http://facebook.com/gravelymaccabre

http://www.etsy.com/shop/gravelymaccabre

On Monday, May 26, 2014 7:46 PM,
“beckieboo817@yahoo.com [runacc]”
<runacc@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I’ve been on the list for several years.  I’ve also asked for info
for various things while lurking too.

International Costumers’ Guild Archivist

http://www.costume.org/gallery2/main.php

“Those Who Fail to Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly –
Why They Are Simply Doomed.”

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C. Y. 4971

Andromeda

 

 

I sent it to her as a forward.  Wait & watch.

Elaine