And there was much rejoicing!!!!!

Kevin Roche wrote:

> Just a quick update for folks who’ve been wondering.
>
> Today we surmounted the final paperwork hurdle and successfully opened
> the CC26 bank account.
>
> So to the 51 people who sent in voting fees — they are now happily
> deposited.

‘k, it’s come up again.

I’m not going to rant about crazymakers who run fleeing everytime
“internet” is mentioned. I am going to say I like the idea of having
convention documents available electronically.

Various comments and suggestions have been floated.

I think printed copies of doc must be available, and should be the
default delivery method for pre-registered members. I think that it’s
worthwhile to have an “opt-out” registration option where a member
could request digital copies only, thus (in theory) cutting the
production budget.

I’m not so sure that advance materials need to be available in print
for at-con registrations. How many committees ended up with tons of
extra print materials at the end of the weekend? A limited number of
print copies and a greater volume of CDs of advance materials may be
more cost-effective.

That requires rules and waivers that specify electronic distribution.

A combined print/digital program book may also be a good cost-saving
option. The print program doesn’t have to be as large, and only
contains information vital to getting through the weekend (“welcome,”
schedule, rules, paid print ads, Con-Stitution if required to be in
print) and the included CD has everything else (all print material plus
bios, paid electronic ads, perhaps a retrospective from the previous
year’s convention, supplemental documents). WorldCon in Glasgow did
this to mixed effect; their choices of things to include in print were
a bit strange.

—
Andy Trembley, Bull-in-Drag
The Bovine Illuminati (It’s the Cows, Inc.)
http://www.bovil.com/
Moo!

Sandy sent a note to Nora for CC25’s Fashion Folio, but I thought I’d
repeat a few of her points here. (Actually they’re my points since
I’m the one who’s been bitching about it.)

First, many designers seem incapable of following directions. Our
rules need to emphasize in large, bold, and capital letters that all
designs must be submitted in BLACK and WHITE LINE ART! We received a
lot of designs that didn’t follow this rule. Some came in blue ink.
Some submitted only color versions. A few submitted black and whites;
but they were photocopies of the colored versions so, of course, were
totally unsuitable for reproduction.

We need, apparently, to emphasize that designs must be on plain
white paper. We received an envelope of designs all on lined paper.

We need to make a change in the rules regarding descriptions.
Normally we’ve always asked for the descriptions on the back of the
designs. However, especially with a lot of people using computers to
print their descriptions, we got a lot of bleed through when we were
scanning designs. (this last is not a case of not following
directions, of course, but a case of changing the directions. 0

I’m having to re-trace a lot of the designs that were selected. Since
the submittal rate was smaller than we would have liked we didn’t
feel we could disqualify anything because of these failures.

The couple of people who submitted designs on disk were great! We
could easily copy the files directly to my holding file. Most of the
folks who did this had a single file with descriptions. So long as it
is easy to correlate descriptions with designs, this works well.

We also may want to emphasize including titles and descriptions with
designs (and note that we also note to refrain from notes and little
arrows on the front of the designs.) We’re beginning to get entries
from fashion design students, which is great, but they have a
different set of conventions then we do and we need to guide them.

Anyone have any comments?

Pierre

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly —
Why They Are Simply Doomed.

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

I agree with all of your comments.

We had the same issues with submissions for the Folio last year.

I definitely think it is time to break the descriptions out onto a second
piece of paper. However, it should be one description per sheet, especially
for judging purposes–the drawing and description need to be together, and
having a stack of drawings and one sheet with all the descriptions doesn’t
work. (We ended up photocopying the multi-description sheet, cutting it
apart, and paper-clipping the individual descriptions to the drawings.)

Obviously, all the variances from the rules that you describe make things
harder for the director, the judges, and the Folio layout person.
Sometimes, you just roll with it and “tweak” things; sometimes, it becomes
an irritating amount of additional work. Unfortunately, the number of
submissions has been so low lately that doing disqualifications would
really hurt the competition.

Fran Evans thinks it might be helpful if we have a “sample” submission that
potential entrants can look at in addition to the written rules. (She
mentioned this to me last year.) Some people are more visually oriented and
will “get” the directions if they can see a demonstration.

I also have to comment, though, that every issue you mention has been an
issue for a long time…we’ve had to “tweak” artwork for the Folio since
Costume-Con 1 (re-drawing, re-shading, whiting out construction notes and
arrows, making up titles and descriptions for designs that have none,
etc.). So I think it’s an ongoing issue, not a recent one.

–Karen

At 04:48 PM 10/17/2005 -0500, you wrote:

>Sandy sent a note to Nora for CC25’s Fashion Folio, but I thought I’d
>repeat a few of her points here. (Actually they’re my points since
>I’m the one who’s been bitching about it.)
>
>First, many designers seem incapable of following directions. Our
>rules need to emphasize in large, bold, and capital letters that all
>designs must be submitted in BLACK and WHITE LINE ART! We received a
>lot of designs that didn’t follow this rule. Some came in blue ink.
>Some submitted only color versions. A few submitted black and whites;
>but they were photocopies of the colored versions so, of course, were
>totally unsuitable for reproduction.
>
>We need, apparently, to emphasize that designs must be on plain
>white paper. We received an envelope of designs all on lined paper.
>
>We need to make a change in the rules regarding descriptions.
>Normally we’ve always asked for the descriptions on the back of the
>designs. However, especially with a lot of people using computers to
>print their descriptions, we got a lot of bleed through when we were
>scanning designs. (this last is not a case of not following
>directions, of course, but a case of changing the directions. 0
>
>I’m having to re-trace a lot of the designs that were selected. Since
>the submittal rate was smaller than we would have liked we didn’t
>feel we could disqualify anything because of these failures.
>
>The couple of people who submitted designs on disk were great! We
>could easily copy the files directly to my holding file. Most of the
>folks who did this had a single file with descriptions. So long as it
>is easy to correlate descriptions with designs, this works well.
>
>We also may want to emphasize including titles and descriptions with
>designs (and note that we also note to refrain from notes and little
>arrows on the front of the designs.) We’re beginning to get entries
>from fashion design students, which is great, but they have a
>different set of conventions then we do and we need to guide them.
>
>Anyone have any comments?
>
>Pierre
>
>
>”Those Who Fail To Learn History
>Are Doomed to Repeat It;
>Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly —
>Why They Are Simply Doomed.
>
>Achemdro’hm
>”The Illusion of Historical Fact”
> — C.Y. 4971
>
>Andromeda
>
>
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

I think that’s an excellent idea!

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Ricky & Karen Dick<mailto:castleb@pulsenet.com>
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com<mailto:runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 12:27 AM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Fashion Folios

Fran Evans thinks it might be helpful if we have a “sample” submission that
potential entrants can look at in addition to the written rules. (She
mentioned this to me last year.) Some people are more visually oriented and
will “get” the directions if they can see a demonstration.

–Karen

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

We’re working on re-designing some elements of the CC25 website & I think
I’ll include that, soudns like a good idea to me.
Do you think the web “sample” is sufficient? We would also include
directions to that sample on our flyers, but I feel like putting them on the
flyer would take up too much space.

Nora

—– Original Message —–
From: “Byron Connell” <bpconnell@verizon.net>
>I think that’s an excellent idea!
> —– Original Message —–
> From: Ricky & Karen Dick<mailto:castleb@pulsenet.com>
> Fran Evans thinks it might be helpful if we have a “sample” submission
> that
> potential entrants can look at in addition to the written rules. (She
> mentioned this to me last year.) Some people are more visually oriented
> and
> will “get” the directions if they can see a demonstration.

At 09:47 PM 10/18/2005, you wrote:

I agree.

Pierre

>I think that’s an excellent idea!
>
>Byron
>
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: Ricky & Karen Dick<mailto:castleb@pulsenet.com>
> To: runacc@yahoogroups.com<mailto:runacc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 12:27 AM
> Subject: Re: [runacc] Fashion Folios
>
>
> Fran Evans thinks it might be helpful if we have a “sample”
> submission that
> potential entrants can look at in addition to the written rules. (She
> mentioned this to me last year.) Some people are more visually
> oriented and
> will “get” the directions if they can see a demonstration.
>
>
> –Karen

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly —
Why They Are Simply Doomed.

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

At 11:27 PM 10/17/2005, you wrote:

>I agree with all of your comments.
>
>We had the same issues with submissions for the Folio last year.
>
>I definitely think it is time to break the descriptions out onto a second
>piece of paper. However, it should be one description per sheet, especially
>for judging purposes–the drawing and description need to be together, and
>having a stack of drawings and one sheet with all the descriptions doesn’t
>work. (We ended up photocopying the multi-description sheet, cutting it
>apart, and paper-clipping the individual descriptions to the drawings.)
>
>Obviously, all the variances from the rules that you describe make things
>harder for the director, the judges, and the Folio layout person.
>Sometimes, you just roll with it and “tweak” things; sometimes, it becomes
>an irritating amount of additional work. Unfortunately, the number of
>submissions has been so low lately that doing disqualifications would
>really hurt the competition.
>
>Fran Evans thinks it might be helpful if we have a “sample” submission that
>potential entrants can look at in addition to the written rules. (She
>mentioned this to me last year.) Some people are more visually oriented and
>will “get” the directions if they can see a demonstration.
>
>I also have to comment, though, that every issue you mention has been an
>issue for a long time…we’ve had to “tweak” artwork for the Folio since
>Costume-Con 1 (re-drawing, re-shading, whiting out construction notes and
>arrows, making up titles and descriptions for designs that have none,
>etc.). So I think it’s an ongoing issue, not a recent one.

Oh, of course. But it certainly seemed much worse this year compared
to the other years we’ve been involved in the Folio creation (CC10
and CC21.) It could be I’m just mis-remembering, but …..

Pierre

>–Karen

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly —
Why They Are Simply Doomed.

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

On Oct 19, 2005, at 2:46 PM, Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:

> Oh, of course. But it certainly seemed much worse this year compared
> to the other years we’ve been involved in the Folio creation (CC10
> and CC21.) It could be I’m just mis-remembering, but …..

I think this falls back to one big thing.

The CC archives on the web have no folio design entries. Yes, they have
show photos, but that’s very different. The only examples we have are
the plates up on Cat’s website, and while that’s great, it’s not our
website.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

Hi!

Karen was working to get permission to publish retroactively from the
designers in the folios, but this is very tough work. A lot of the
designers aren’t reachable by any useful means, and some are ADAMANT
that their designs not be reproduced. Even at 72dpi, the images may
still be reproduced elsewhere. I get email all the time (especially
during Halloween) asking where this costume or that is available to
purchase.

While I’ve taken considerable liberty in publishing the photos of the
costumes, I can’t do that with the folios.

And then there’s the scanning/editing time.

I’m working on catching up the site (photos only), but believe me,
watching Katie is a full-time job, unlike Erin was. She’s not content to
sit and play with toys. She’s very good mechanically and much stronger
than her sister was at this age. Translation? I get 15 minutes, tops, at
the computer per session before I’m interrupted and have to stop her
from doing something detrimental to herself or my stuff.

I don’t even have the time right now to shift the job to someone else.

I can take comfort in knowing that this will change in another year or
so, but until she goes off to preschool (Sept, 2007 unless I get her
into a full-time program, and that would mean I’ve gotten a day job),
I’m stuck.

Frustrated in Maryland
(aka Betsy)

Andrew T Trembley wrote:

> On Oct 19, 2005, at 2:46 PM, Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:
>
>>Oh, of course. But it certainly seemed much worse this year compared
>>to the other years we’ve been involved in the Folio creation (CC10
>>and CC21.) It could be I’m just mis-remembering, but …..
>
>
> I think this falls back to one big thing.
>
> The CC archives on the web have no folio design entries. Yes, they have
> show photos, but that’s very different. The only examples we have are
> the plates up on Cat’s website, and while that’s great, it’s not our
> website.
>

—
—
Betsy Delaney
*************************************************************************
http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
*************************************************************************

At 04:13 PM 10/20/2005, you wrote:

>Hi!
>
>Karen was working to get permission to publish retroactively from the
>designers in the folios, but this is very tough work. A lot of the
>designers aren’t reachable by any useful means, and some are ADAMANT
>that their designs not be reproduced. Even at 72dpi, the images may
>still be reproduced elsewhere. I get email all the time (especially
>during Halloween) asking where this costume or that is available to
>purchase.

Betsy,

I think I’ve mentioned this before. However, when and if you do get
around to it, you have our permission to use any of our design
drawings. If you need something officially signed, send it along when needed.

Pierre

>While I’ve taken considerable liberty in publishing the photos of the
>costumes, I can’t do that with the folios.
>
>And then there’s the scanning/editing time.
>
>I’m working on catching up the site (photos only), but believe me,
>watching Katie is a full-time job, unlike Erin was. She’s not content to
>sit and play with toys. She’s very good mechanically and much stronger
>than her sister was at this age. Translation? I get 15 minutes, tops, at
>the computer per session before I’m interrupted and have to stop her
>from doing something detrimental to herself or my stuff.
>
>I don’t even have the time right now to shift the job to someone else.
>
>I can take comfort in knowing that this will change in another year or
>so, but until she goes off to preschool (Sept, 2007 unless I get her
>into a full-time program, and that would mean I’ve gotten a day job),
>I’m stuck.
>
>Frustrated in Maryland
>(aka Betsy)
>
>Andrew T Trembley wrote:
> > On Oct 19, 2005, at 2:46 PM, Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:
> >
> >>Oh, of course. But it certainly seemed much worse this year compared
> >>to the other years we’ve been involved in the Folio creation (CC10
> >>and CC21.) It could be I’m just mis-remembering, but …..
> >
> >
> > I think this falls back to one big thing.
> >
> > The CC archives on the web have no folio design entries. Yes, they have
> > show photos, but that’s very different. The only examples we have are
> > the plates up on Cat’s website, and while that’s great, it’s not our
> > website.
> >
>Betsy Delaney

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed to Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly —
Why They Are Simply Doomed.

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

Yep! I think I knew that. I got a short list from Karen a while ago,
when she was working actively on the project last, but it’s buried
somewhere in my email. I’m right there with you. (I was prolific for a
solid five years before I burned out on the line art.)

Thanks!

Betsy

Pierre & Sandy Pettinger wrote:

> Betsy,
>
> I think I’ve mentioned this before. However, when and if you do get
> around to it, you have our permission to use any of our design
> drawings. If you need something officially signed, send it along when needed.
>
> Pierre

—
—
Betsy Delaney
*************************************************************************
http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
*************************************************************************

Big favor…

CC26 is looking for past CC financial records to help us flesh out our
budget planning process. I know Betsy has the CC15 budget posted on
costume-con.org, but that’s a decade ago so the numbers are only going
to remotely apply.

Any of you willing to email me copies of records so we can make sure
that our forecasts are sane?

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
“It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
–Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

2nd most important safety device on my bike: the one beneath my right
hand
Most important safety device on my bike: the one inside my helmet

We don’t have a whole lot, and what we do have would be not much different
than Betsy’s

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew T Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: “Lisa Deutsch Harrigan” <lisa@harrigan.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 5:45 PM
Subject: [runacc] Budget files/spreadsheets

> Big favor…
>
> CC26 is looking for past CC financial records to help us flesh out our
> budget planning process. I know Betsy has the CC15 budget posted on
> costume-con.org, but that’s a decade ago so the numbers are only going
> to remotely apply.
>
> Any of you willing to email me copies of records so we can make sure
> that our forecasts are sane?
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> (Kevin’s)
> “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel
>
> 2nd most important safety device on my bike: the one beneath my right
> hand
> Most important safety device on my bike: the one inside my helmet
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Nora and I were having another one of our “costume wonk” discussions
yesterday morning, and we came up with what we thought was a neat idea.

There’s been much discussion on the CC25 list about free memberships, and
Pierre and I need to hash out where are the best venues for doing so.
(That’s another discussion for another time.)

What I want to speak to specifically is a subject brought up more than once
on the D list, among other places, by mostly younger folks. To wit: We’re
all trying to reach out to the younger set to bring them to our playground,
but they find it prohibitively expensive to attend, in comparison to the
relative low cost of an anime con. This is going to continue to be a
barrier in the future. We, as organizers, have professed a need to bring in
more attendees and broaden the con’s appeal.

One of the ways this has been done in the past is to give away free
memberships to the BIS or “Most Promising Novice” winners at regionals. (Has
it been done at Worldcons? I don’t know).

Some CCs have had reduced rates for students, which I think is a good idea.
We’re going to do this at CC25.

But here’s our concept: What about a grant to a particular person who
otherwise could not attend because of economic reasons? This would amount
to not only the price of a membership, but a room — possibly traveling
expenses (gas money, essentially) and maybe something for food. We see
this as a pretty low-cost, philanthropic win-win situation. Unfortunately,
it’s probably too late for us to do, but something maybe the future CC heads
might want to think about.

Obviously, this is all predicated on whether Karen would approve of this.

Here are some questions, with some possible answers, but obviously not the
only ones.

1. How is a worthy recipient determined?
Possibly an application process.

2. Are there any parameters, like age, economic status?.
I’m thinking that the only factor that would probably rule someone
immediately is whether they’d been to a CC before. If someone has an
interest in costuming, no matter what their age, they should be eligible,
otherwise. Economic status is entirely different thing. Not sure how to
handle that. That’s why it may be easier to pick a young person, rather
than someone our own age.

3. Who determines who is worthy?
There would have to be a committee. That committee could either be
appointed by Karen or made up of future committee people.

3. How much money are we actually talking here?
As I thought about this, the cost could be relatively low, depending on the
cooperation of the various concoms. Memberships are essentially “free”.
Frequently, hotels give a certain number of free room nights to the
committee as part of their contract — that might be another cost cut. So
the real cost would be the gas money and any other money for food. Perhaps
a good way to handle this even better would be that the recipient must come
from the region where that year’s CC would be.

And here’s a good reason why: publicity. By promoting the grant at the
local schools, historical recreation groups, SCA events, etc., it would
generate a buzz in those communities. It could also be promoted in various
publications, websites, and so on. Promoting the fact that the grant has a
value somewhere in the three-figure range, this might get some local press
coverage, too.

My guess is that a grant would be made possible by willing concoms with
money left over after all other expenses have been taken care of. We know
that there has been an informal tradition of giving “seed money” to future
concoms – why not set aside a small amount to make this possible? It
wouldn’t be declared as an annual thing, so there’s no pressure on the
committees. If there’s not enough money, a grant would not be announced.

There are some other details about the recipient selection process I have
partially thought out, but I can’t quite get them down in words without
making things overly complicated. Right now, we’d just like to hear what
you folks think.

Bruce

OK, so you generate a lot of buzz, and everyone gets excited about going
– to the next CC, which will be hundreds of miles away. They won’t come
to ours until the first person (with the “grant”) reports back that it
was cool.

I’m not saying I don’t like the grant idea, per se; it simply doesn’t
work well with a floating convention. For a convention that stays put
in a city from year to year, yeah, it makes a lot of sense.

Karen

Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:

> Nora and I were having another one of our “costume wonk” discussions
> yesterday morning, and we came up with what we thought was a neat idea.
>
>
> What I want to speak to specifically is a subject brought up more than
> once
> on the D list, among other places, by mostly younger folks. To wit:
> We’re
> all trying to reach out to the younger set to bring them to our
> playground,
> but they find it prohibitively expensive to attend, in comparison to the
> relative low cost of an anime con. This is going to continue to be a
> barrier in the future. We, as organizers, have professed a need to
> bring in
> more attendees and broaden the con’s appeal.
>
> One of the ways this has been done in the past is to give away free
> memberships to the BIS or “Most Promising Novice” winners at
> regionals. (Has
> it been done at Worldcons? I don’t know).
>
> Some CCs have had reduced rates for students, which I think is a good
> idea.
> We’re going to do this at CC25.
>
> But here’s our concept: What about a grant to a particular person who
> otherwise could not attend because of economic reasons? This would
> amount
> to not only the price of a membership, but a room — possibly traveling
> expenses (gas money, essentially) and maybe something for food. We see
> this as a pretty low-cost, philanthropic win-win situation.
> Unfortunately,
> it’s probably too late for us to do, but something maybe the future CC
> heads
> might want to think about.
>
> Obviously, this is all predicated on whether Karen would approve of this.
>
> Here are some questions, with some possible answers, but obviously not
> the
> only ones.
>
> 1. How is a worthy recipient determined?
> Possibly an application process.
>
> 2. Are there any parameters, like age, economic status?.
> I’m thinking that the only factor that would probably rule someone
> immediately is whether they’d been to a CC before. If someone has an
> interest in costuming, no matter what their age, they should be eligible,
> otherwise. Economic status is entirely different thing. Not sure how to
> handle that. That’s why it may be easier to pick a young person, rather
> than someone our own age.
>
> 3. Who determines who is worthy?
> There would have to be a committee. That committee could either be
> appointed by Karen or made up of future committee people.
>
> 3. How much money are we actually talking here?
> As I thought about this, the cost could be relatively low, depending
> on the
> cooperation of the various concoms. Memberships are essentially “free”.
> Frequently, hotels give a certain number of free room nights to the
> committee as part of their contract — that might be another cost
> cut. So
> the real cost would be the gas money and any other money for food.
> Perhaps
> a good way to handle this even better would be that the recipient must
> come
> from the region where that year’s CC would be.
>
> And here’s a good reason why: publicity. By promoting the grant at the
> local schools, historical recreation groups, SCA events, etc., it would
> generate a buzz in those communities. It could also be promoted in
> various
> publications, websites, and so on. Promoting the fact that the grant
> has a
> value somewhere in the three-figure range, this might get some local
> press
> coverage, too.
>
> My guess is that a grant would be made possible by willing concoms with
> money left over after all other expenses have been taken care of. We
> know
> that there has been an informal tradition of giving “seed money” to
> future
> concoms – why not set aside a small amount to make this possible? It
> wouldn’t be declared as an annual thing, so there’s no pressure on the
> committees. If there’s not enough money, a grant would not be announced.
>
> There are some other details about the recipient selection process I have
> partially thought out, but I can’t quite get them down in words without
> making things overly complicated. Right now, we’d just like to hear what
> you folks think.
>

A review of the procedures used for TAFF and DUFF (the Trans-Atlantic Fan Fund and the Down Under Fan Fund) to bring an SF fan to North America every other year from Europe and Australia, and to send one to each location from North America in the interval, might provide leads on how such grants are made and to whom.

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Bruce & Nora Mai<mailto:casamai@sbcglobal.net>
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com<mailto:runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2005 3:38 PM
Subject: [runacc] A CC25 grant?

Nora and I were having another one of our “costume wonk” discussions
yesterday morning, and we came up with what we thought was a neat idea.

There’s been much discussion on the CC25 list about free memberships, and
Pierre and I need to hash out where are the best venues for doing so.
(That’s another discussion for another time.)

What I want to speak to specifically is a subject brought up more than once
on the D list, among other places, by mostly younger folks. To wit: We’re
all trying to reach out to the younger set to bring them to our playground,
but they find it prohibitively expensive to attend, in comparison to the
relative low cost of an anime con. This is going to continue to be a
barrier in the future. We, as organizers, have professed a need to bring in
more attendees and broaden the con’s appeal.

One of the ways this has been done in the past is to give away free
memberships to the BIS or “Most Promising Novice” winners at regionals. (Has
it been done at Worldcons? I don’t know).

Some CCs have had reduced rates for students, which I think is a good idea.
We’re going to do this at CC25.

But here’s our concept: What about a grant to a particular person who
otherwise could not attend because of economic reasons? This would amount
to not only the price of a membership, but a room — possibly traveling
expenses (gas money, essentially) and maybe something for food. We see
this as a pretty low-cost, philanthropic win-win situation. Unfortunately,
it’s probably too late for us to do, but something maybe the future CC heads
might want to think about.

Obviously, this is all predicated on whether Karen would approve of this.

Here are some questions, with some possible answers, but obviously not the
only ones.

1. How is a worthy recipient determined?
Possibly an application process.

2. Are there any parameters, like age, economic status?.
I’m thinking that the only factor that would probably rule someone
immediately is whether they’d been to a CC before. If someone has an
interest in costuming, no matter what their age, they should be eligible,
otherwise. Economic status is entirely different thing. Not sure how to
handle that. That’s why it may be easier to pick a young person, rather
than someone our own age.

3. Who determines who is worthy?
There would have to be a committee. That committee could either be
appointed by Karen or made up of future committee people.

3. How much money are we actually talking here?
As I thought about this, the cost could be relatively low, depending on the
cooperation of the various concoms. Memberships are essentially “free”.
Frequently, hotels give a certain number of free room nights to the
committee as part of their contract — that might be another cost cut. So
the real cost would be the gas money and any other money for food. Perhaps
a good way to handle this even better would be that the recipient must come
from the region where that year’s CC would be.

And here’s a good reason why: publicity. By promoting the grant at the
local schools, historical recreation groups, SCA events, etc., it would
generate a buzz in those communities. It could also be promoted in various
publications, websites, and so on. Promoting the fact that the grant has a
value somewhere in the three-figure range, this might get some local press
coverage, too.

My guess is that a grant would be made possible by willing concoms with
money left over after all other expenses have been taken care of. We know
that there has been an informal tradition of giving “seed money” to future
concoms – why not set aside a small amount to make this possible? It
wouldn’t be declared as an annual thing, so there’s no pressure on the
committees. If there’s not enough money, a grant would not be announced.

There are some other details about the recipient selection process I have
partially thought out, but I can’t quite get them down in words without
making things overly complicated. Right now, we’d just like to hear what
you folks think.

Bruce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Byron Connell wrote:

> A review of the procedures used for TAFF and DUFF (the Trans-Atlantic Fan Fund and the Down Under Fan Fund) to bring an SF fan to North America every other year from Europe and Australia, and to send one to each location from North America in the interval, might provide leads on how such grants are made and to whom.

Chaz Boston-Baden ran for TAFF last year, but didn’t win.

TAFF and DUFF are popular-vote contests. They tend to be fanzine-fan
centered.

You have to pay to vote, and the voting fees go to the winner of the
vote to defray their WorldCon expenses.

The winner of TAFF (a European fan when WorldCon isn’t in Europe, a US
fan when WorldCon is in Europe) is required to write a convention report
(a one-shot fanzine is the generally accepted format). They’re also
responsible to promote and administer the next year’s TAFF vote.

So, not necessarily a great model for us.

(Some of us joke about creating MAFF, the Mid-Atlantic Fan Fund in which
we elect a fan to throw out of the plane while over the mid-Atlantic.)

andy

I like the idea. You might check with Darla to find out how Costume College
handles their scholarships. It seems as if it would be a similar thing.

Elaine

Nil significat nisi oscillat!

>
>Nora and I were having another one of our “costume wonk” discussions
>yesterday morning, and we came up with what we thought was a neat idea.
>
>There’s been much discussion on the CC25 list about free memberships, and
>Pierre and I need to hash out where are the best venues for doing so.
>(That’s another discussion for another time.)
>
>What I want to speak to specifically is a subject brought up more than once
>on the D list, among other places, by mostly younger folks. To wit: We’re
>all trying to reach out to the younger set to bring them to our playground,
>but they find it prohibitively expensive to attend, in comparison to the
>relative low cost of an anime con. This is going to continue to be a
>barrier in the future. We, as organizers, have professed a need to bring
>in
>more attendees and broaden the con’s appeal.
>
>One of the ways this has been done in the past is to give away free
>memberships to the BIS or “Most Promising Novice” winners at regionals.
>(Has
>it been done at Worldcons? I don’t know).
>
>Some CCs have had reduced rates for students, which I think is a good idea.
>We’re going to do this at CC25.
>
>But here’s our concept: What about a grant to a particular person who
>otherwise could not attend because of economic reasons? This would amount
>to not only the price of a membership, but a room — possibly traveling
>expenses (gas money, essentially) and maybe something for food. We see
>this as a pretty low-cost, philanthropic win-win situation. Unfortunately,
>it’s probably too late for us to do, but something maybe the future CC
>heads
>might want to think about.
>
>Obviously, this is all predicated on whether Karen would approve of this.
>
>Here are some questions, with some possible answers, but obviously not the
>only ones.
>
>1. How is a worthy recipient determined?
>Possibly an application process.
>
>2. Are there any parameters, like age, economic status?.
>I’m thinking that the only factor that would probably rule someone
>immediately is whether they’d been to a CC before. If someone has an
>interest in costuming, no matter what their age, they should be eligible,
>otherwise. Economic status is entirely different thing. Not sure how to
>handle that. That’s why it may be easier to pick a young person, rather
>than someone our own age.
>
>3. Who determines who is worthy?
>There would have to be a committee. That committee could either be
>appointed by Karen or made up of future committee people.
>
>3. How much money are we actually talking here?
>As I thought about this, the cost could be relatively low, depending on the
>cooperation of the various concoms. Memberships are essentially “free”.
>Frequently, hotels give a certain number of free room nights to the
>committee as part of their contract — that might be another cost cut. So
>the real cost would be the gas money and any other money for food. Perhaps
>a good way to handle this even better would be that the recipient must come
>from the region where that year’s CC would be.
>
>And here’s a good reason why: publicity. By promoting the grant at the
>local schools, historical recreation groups, SCA events, etc., it would
>generate a buzz in those communities. It could also be promoted in various
>publications, websites, and so on. Promoting the fact that the grant has a
>value somewhere in the three-figure range, this might get some local press
>coverage, too.
>
>My guess is that a grant would be made possible by willing concoms with
>money left over after all other expenses have been taken care of. We know
>that there has been an informal tradition of giving “seed money” to future
>concoms – why not set aside a small amount to make this possible? It
>wouldn’t be declared as an annual thing, so there’s no pressure on the
>committees. If there’s not enough money, a grant would not be announced.
>
>There are some other details about the recipient selection process I have
>partially thought out, but I can’t quite get them down in words without
>making things overly complicated. Right now, we’d just like to hear what
>you folks think.
>
>Bruce
>
>
>
>

I wondered about grants, both with CC-23, and CONduit.

For CONduit the policy shifts from year-to-year, chair-to-chair. One aspect that we have is that of “will-work-for-con”. So a few particular departments, and/or the Chair, have the authority (without going through all of the concom) to waive a significant part of membership (I don’t know if they have ever supplied rooms or transport). We do have a somewhat over-stocked con-suite, to help defray cost for some fans.

The CONduit method appears to work if: it’s not abused by departments/chairs, and if nobody complains too much about “unfair” treatment. We do not advertise this accomadation to the general public.

I was concerned about CC-23 for a variety of reasons. I thought it would be nice to have a DUFF-type (Overseas type) sponsorship, but we never mananged to set something up. We wondered about discount rate for local fans that worked the con — fans without a strong costume-fan connection (which we did impliment as some level), but willing to work, and did discount some memberships for that. Without going into details, I did help out a few fans with room-space, such as in noisy buffer space around the consuite — discount rate partially funded out of my pocket, and con comp rooms (by consuite). We had a few panalists that could barely afford to come, but in at least one case was able to ask for help, and I believe did get some.

I think we also had some of the “new award winning fan” type membership awardees attend.

In general, I belived that it was a good idea to help some fans in, but also found it difficult to create a good system.

Perhaps part of pass-along funds (not in any formal way?) be used for sponsoring — since it is “found” money?

Charles Galway
CC-23 Utah, 2005

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Responses below:

—- Original Message —–
From: “Karen Heim” <axejudge@accessus.net>

> OK, so you generate a lot of buzz, and everyone gets excited about going
> – to the next CC, which will be hundreds of miles away. They won’t come
> to ours until the first person (with the “grant”) reports back that it
> was cool.
>
> I’m not saying I don’t like the grant idea, per se; it simply doesn’t
> work well with a floating convention. For a convention that stays put
> in a city from year to year, yeah, it makes a lot of sense.
>
> Karen

This is why it’s best for the grant to be done IN the region where the con
will be.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Charles” <cgalway@xmission.com>

>
> Perhaps part of pass-along funds (not in any formal way?) be used for
> sponsoring — since it is “found” money?
>
> Charles Galway
> CC-23 Utah, 2005
>
That’s what I said – “pass along money” where a tidy profit, after all is
paid for, to be forwarded to that host city.

Bruce

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

On Oct 31, 2005, at 4:19 PM, Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:

> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Charles” <cgalway@xmission.com>
>> Perhaps part of pass-along funds (not in any formal way?) be used for
>> sponsoring — since it is “found” money?
>>
> That’s what I said – “pass along money” where a tidy profit, after all
> is
> paid for, to be forwarded to that host city.

Pass-along funds are there for the recipients to use as they see fit.
Sometimes they’re needed more for advance expenses, and having them
tied to funding a grant program would be harmful to the convention.

—
Andy Trembley, Bull-in-Drag
The Bovine Illuminati (It’s the Cows, Inc.)
http://www.bovil.com/
Moo!

That’s a good point — of not tying up pass along funds. In a sense, I think that part of the point is not to actually spend up the pass-along-fund, but to rather use it for early seed money, and then still be able to pass it along, after the con is over.

Charles

—– Original Message —–
From: Andrew T Trembley

Pass-along funds are there for the recipients to use as they see fit.
Sometimes they’re needed more for advance expenses, and having them
tied to funding a grant program would be harmful to the convention.

—
Andy Trembley, Bull-in-Drag
The Bovine Illuminati (It’s the Cows, Inc.)
http://www.bovil.com/
Moo!

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I believe I took this into account when I said:

> My guess is that a grant would be made possible by willing concoms with
> money left over after all other expenses have been taken care of. We know
> that there has been an informal tradition of giving “seed money” to future
> concoms – why not set aside a small amount to make this possible? It
> wouldn’t be declared as an annual thing, so there’s no pressure on the
> committees. If there’s not enough money, a grant would not be announced.

Emphasis on >willing< , and >no pressure ont the committees<

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew T Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 31, 2005 7:17 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] A CC25 grant?

>
> On Oct 31, 2005, at 4:19 PM, Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Charles” <cgalway@xmission.com>
>>> Perhaps part of pass-along funds (not in any formal way?) be used for
>>> sponsoring — since it is “found” money?
>>>
>> That’s what I said – “pass along money” where a tidy profit, after all
>> is
>> paid for, to be forwarded to that host city.
>
> Pass-along funds are there for the recipients to use as they see fit.
> Sometimes they’re needed more for advance expenses, and having them
> tied to funding a grant program would be harmful to the convention.
>
> —
> Andy Trembley, Bull-in-Drag
> The Bovine Illuminati (It’s the Cows, Inc.)
> http://www.bovil.com/
> Moo!
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I think a scholarship/grant is a good idea, provided it can be accomplished
without bankrupting the concom. Therefore, I think it needs to be optional
vs. mandatory, but a nice “extra” if a con can pull it off.

Re funding sources, has anybody considered approaching local sewing or
crafts-related businesses in their community to help “sponsor” a deserving
person to attend the con? Maybe offer ad space in the program book or on
the web site in exchange for $$ to go toward the grant…

–Karen

On Nov 4, 2005, at 12:00 PM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:

> I think a scholarship/grant is a good idea, provided it can be
> accomplished
> without bankrupting the concom. Therefore, I think it needs to be
> optional
> vs. mandatory, but a nice “extra” if a con can pull it off.
>
> Re funding sources, has anybody considered approaching local sewing or
> crafts-related businesses in their community to help “sponsor” a
> deserving
> person to attend the con? Maybe offer ad space in the program book or
> on
> the web site in exchange for $$ to go toward the grant…

How is this for a model?

CC24 (just for the sake of picking a number) has passed funds forward
and still has some cash. They, as a last act, use some of the remaining
funds to sponsor someone from their region to CC25 or CC26 (depending
on when their books settle). No obligations for a concom to do this,
but a good way for the con to give back to the local area and to an
upcoming convention.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
http://www.bovil.com/
“It’s not pink; it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.” –Manfred Pfirsich
Marie Rommel

I’m OK with that.

Other models are possible.

–Karen

At 01:25 PM 11/4/2005 -0800, you wrote:

>On Nov 4, 2005, at 12:00 PM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:
>
> > I think a scholarship/grant is a good idea, provided it can be
> > accomplished
> > without bankrupting the concom. Therefore, I think it needs to be
> > optional
> > vs. mandatory, but a nice “extra” if a con can pull it off.
> >
> > Re funding sources, has anybody considered approaching local sewing or
> > crafts-related businesses in their community to help “sponsor” a
> > deserving
> > person to attend the con? Maybe offer ad space in the program book or
> > on
> > the web site in exchange for $$ to go toward the grant…
>
>How is this for a model?
>
>CC24 (just for the sake of picking a number) has passed funds forward
>and still has some cash. They, as a last act, use some of the remaining
>funds to sponsor someone from their region to CC25 or CC26 (depending
>on when their books settle). No obligations for a concom to do this,
>but a good way for the con to give back to the local area and to an
>upcoming convention.
>
>–
>
>andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
>http://www.bovil.com/
>”It’s not pink; it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.” –Manfred Pfirsich
>Marie Rommel
>
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

Well, the only problem might be whether or not transportation funds are
realistically affordable for the con to do. Otherwise, what are the chances
someone in Des Moines is going to come to CC26, for instance? (Flight
tickets vs. some sort of voucher for gas money to drive ro rent a car)

That’s why I would think it’s better for someone to be sponsored in the area
where that year’s con takes place.

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew T Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 3:25 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] A CC25 grant?

>
> How is this for a model?
>
> CC24 (just for the sake of picking a number) has passed funds forward
> and still has some cash. They, as a last act, use some of the remaining
> funds to sponsor someone from their region to CC25 or CC26 (depending
> on when their books settle). No obligations for a concom to do this,
> but a good way for the con to give back to the local area and to an
> upcoming convention.
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
> http://www.bovil.com/
> “It’s not pink; it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.” –Manfred Pfirsich
> Marie Rommel
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Since Karen seems amenable, let’s flesh out the model a little further: Who
decides who gets the grant and how is that determined?

Bruce

Should it be a nomination process (people suggest deserving individuals),
or an application process (individuals apply to be considered for a grant)?

–Karen

At 12:48 PM 11/6/2005 -0600, you wrote:

>Since Karen seems amenable, let’s flesh out the model a little further: Who
>decides who gets the grant and how is that determined?
>
>Bruce
>
>
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

I think I like the nomination process slightly better.

Can’t say why…

-b

Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:

> Should it be a nomination process (people suggest deserving individuals),
> or an application process (individuals apply to be considered for a grant)?
>
> –Karen
>
> At 12:48 PM 11/6/2005 -0600, you wrote:
>
>>Since Karen seems amenable, let’s flesh out the model a little further: Who
>>decides who gets the grant and how is that determined?
>>
>>Bruce
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

—
—
Betsy Delaney
*************************************************************************
http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
*************************************************************************

I also favor the nomination process. I just don’t feel comfortable with the
“I am needy, and here’s proof of why I am deserving” part of the application
process.

Just my opinion.

Elaine

Nil significat nisi oscillat!

>I think I like the nomination process slightly better.
>
>Can’t say why…
>
>-b
>
>Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:
> > Should it be a nomination process (people suggest deserving
>individuals),
> > or an application process (individuals apply to be considered for a
>grant)?
> >
> > –Karen
> >
> > At 12:48 PM 11/6/2005 -0600, you wrote:
> >
> >>Since Karen seems amenable, let’s flesh out the model a little further:
>Who
> >>decides who gets the grant and how is that determined?
> >>
> >>Bruce
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> >>Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>–
>–
>Betsy Delaney
>*************************************************************************
> http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
> http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
> http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
>*************************************************************************

Anybody else?

We seem to be leaning toward nomination vs. application…is this a true thing?

I’m leaning that direction because in an application process, you get very
talented shy folk who are not willing to blow their own horn, and less
talented but more aggressive folk who will inflate their costuming resume
and their impoverished status if given the opportunity.

If so, who gets to nominate? (The current committee? The committee donating
$$$? A nationwide cross-section of of current and former CC committee
people? A specially assigned scholarship commission? ???)

–Karen

At 08:54 AM 11/7/2005 -0500, you wrote:

>I also favor the nomination process. I just don’t feel comfortable with the
>”I am needy, and here’s proof of why I am deserving” part of the application
>process.
>
>Just my opinion.
>
>Elaine
>
>Nil significat nisi oscillat!
>
>
> >I think I like the nomination process slightly better.
> >
> >Can’t say why…
> >
> >-b
> >
> >Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:
> > > Should it be a nomination process (people suggest deserving
> >individuals),
> > > or an application process (individuals apply to be considered for a
> >grant)?
> > >
> > > –Karen
> > >
> > > At 12:48 PM 11/6/2005 -0600, you wrote:
> > >
> > >>Since Karen seems amenable, let’s flesh out the model a little further:
> >Who
> > >>decides who gets the grant and how is that determined?
> > >>
> > >>Bruce
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> > >>Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >–
> >–
> >Betsy Delaney
> >*************************************************************************
> > http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
> > http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
> > http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
> >*************************************************************************
>
>
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

In a message dated 11/7/2005 9:04:39 AM Central Standard Time,
castleb@pulsenet.com writes:

> e seem to be leaning toward nomination vs. application…is this a true
> thing?
>

I also lean towards Nomination.

> I’m leaning that direction because in an application process, you get very
> talented shy folk who are not willing to blow their own horn, and less
> talented but more aggressive folk who will inflate their costuming resume
> and their impoverished status if given the opportunity.
>

Without going into details, or naming names, I know exactly what you are
talking about.

I have encountered some folks in the Reenactor scene that are really good at
making the clothes of their time periods. I have told them about CostumeCon,
and some have heard about it. Some have not. I planned ahead for that
eventuality and have made a little handout with websites for the ICG, CC’s, etc. I have
a feeling that there are some folks I can get to go to a CC that would be
interested.

> If so, who gets to nominate? (The current committee? The committee donating
>
> $$$? A nationwide cross-section of of current and former CC committee
> people? A specially assigned scholarship commission? ???)

I think the nominations should be done by committee for that CC who live in
the area of that CC. It would keep the cost down, and attract more locals who
have never heard of it.

Henry

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I need a good hold-harmless release and model release for a competition
I’m running in January. Anybody willing to provide samples?

andy

In a message dated 12/3/2005 2:21:37 PM Central Standard Time,
attrembl@bovil.com writes:

> I need a good hold-harmless release and model release for a competition
> I’m running in January. Anybody willing to provide samples?

Best I have is CC21’s photo release.
Henry

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

We were just making an observation here: Each section says “contact the
director”, but there are no names? Who are they?

And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
supposed to go to the website. Why?

Bruce

In a message dated 1/1/2006 8:06:06 PM Central Standard Time,
casamai@sbcglobal.net writes:

> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
> supposed to go to the website. Why?

I’d imagine that a CC’s weapon policy is in the hands of that particular CC.
Henry Osier

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

No, no. Why shoudl I have to go to the website to find it out if that’s
what you’re even supposed to do.

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: <osierhenry@cs.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 2:53 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] CC24 PR

> In a message dated 1/1/2006 8:06:06 PM Central Standard Time,
> casamai@sbcglobal.net writes:
>> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
>> supposed to go to the website. Why?
> I’d imagine that a CC’s weapon policy is in the hands of that particular
> CC.
> Henry Osier
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

I haven’t gotten the PR, but I moved, so it’s probably being forwarded.

But, let’s not dwell on why a prior CC may or may not have done something, let’s just learn and improve.

Michael

> ——-Original Message——-
> From: Bruce & Nora Mai <casamai@sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: [runacc] CC24 PR – weapons policy
> Sent: 03 Jan ’06 23:41
>
> No, no. Why shoudl I have to go to the website to find it out if that’s
> what you’re even supposed to do.
>
> Bruce
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: <osierhenry@cs.com>
> To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 2:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [runacc] CC24 PR
>
>
> > In a message dated 1/1/2006 8:06:06 PM Central Standard Time,
> > casamai@sbcglobal.net writes:
> >> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
> >> supposed to go to the website. Why?
> > I’d imagine that a CC’s weapon policy is in the hands of that particular
> > CC.
> > Henry Osier
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

In a message dated 1/3/2006 5:41:27 PM Central Standard Time,
casamai@sbcglobal.net writes:

> No, no. Why shoudl I have to go to the website to find it out if that’s
> what you’re even supposed to do.

Ah! Gotcha! Now I understand the question.
Henry

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I agree with Bruce.

While every CC sets its own weapons policy based on hotel/local/state rules,
it should be clearly defined and published. It is true that not everyone
uses computers for all of their information. I would expect everything in
the PR to be repeated (and maybe expanded upon) on the web site. However, I
still want my information in hard copy. It’s easier to file, and much
easier to read in the *throne* room.

And for those times when the computers are down……………………..

Elaine

Nil significat nisi oscillat!

>From: “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@sbcglobal.net>
>Reply-To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [runacc] CC24 PR – weapons policy
>Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 17:41:14 -0600
>
>No, no. Why shoudl I have to go to the website to find it out if that’s
>what you’re even supposed to do.
>
>Bruce
>
>—– Original Message —–
>From: <osierhenry@cs.com>
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 2:53 PM
>Subject: Re: [runacc] CC24 PR
>
>
> > In a message dated 1/1/2006 8:06:06 PM Central Standard Time,
> > casamai@sbcglobal.net writes:
> >> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
> >> supposed to go to the website. Why?
> > I’d imagine that a CC’s weapon policy is in the hands of that particular
> > CC.
> > Henry Osier
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

— In runacc@yahoogroups.com, “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@s…>
wrote:

>
> We were just making an observation here: Each section

says “contact the

> director”, but there are no names? Who are they?

The decision not to use names for the positions was a practical one.
We’ve had several staff changes so far not to mention email and snail
mail address changes for our staff. This sort of thing does happen
and can even happen at this late date. By using titles for the
contact information and the “whoever”@epicmovies.org as well as the
convention address we can maintain continuity through out all our
publications. This minimizes confusion as well as lost messages.

> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably,

you’re

> supposed to go to the website. Why?

This PR contained the rules for the contests as published by the
MDs. The weapons policies mentioned are those of that particular
contest. It was not our intention to publish conference policy at
this time. Each MD has the prerogative with the approval of ConCom
to establish weapons guidelines appropriate to their venue. These
guidelines may be more or less stringent than the conference policy.
We will endeavor to make the conference weapon policy and indeed all
conference policies as close as possible to those of the contests.
However, we also recognize that there can be a different set of
standards for on stage verses wandering the halls.

There’s only so much information we can get out at one time. Space,
time and money dictate much of those choices. We felt it was
important to get out the contest rules at this time. Future
publications will contain further information.

Sallie Abba
Co-Chair CC-24

Sallie,

Thank you.

Elaine

Nil significat nisi oscillat!

>
>The decision not to use names for the positions was a practical one.
>We’ve had several staff changes so far not to mention email and snail
>mail address changes for our staff. This sort of thing does happen
>and can even happen at this late date. By using titles for the
>contact information and the “whoever”@epicmovies.org as well as the
>convention address we can maintain continuity through out all our
>publications. This minimizes confusion as well as lost messages.
>
>>
>This PR contained the rules for the contests as published by the
>MDs. The weapons policies mentioned are those of that particular
>contest. It was not our intention to publish conference policy at
>this time. Each MD has the prerogative with the approval of ConCom
>to establish weapons guidelines appropriate to their venue. These
>guidelines may be more or less stringent than the conference policy.
>We will endeavor to make the conference weapon policy and indeed all
>conference policies as close as possible to those of the contests.
>However, we also recognize that there can be a different set of
>standards for on stage verses wandering the halls.
>
>There’s only so much information we can get out at one time. Space,
>time and money dictate much of those choices. We felt it was
>important to get out the contest rules at this time. Future
>publications will contain further information.
>
>Sallie Abba
>Co-Chair CC-24
>
>
>
>
>

Well said, regarding the publication of rules.

I would like to point out, as archivist, that I do use the PRs to gather
some of my data. Choosing not to include individual names for each
committee position can sometimes pose a problem from the perspective of
history and may make it difficult for con members who want to contact a
committee member to do so, especially if there is no name to go with the
role. If there is a communication problem (which happens sometimes,
especially with email addresses), I could imagine a point where it might
be difficult to pinpoint the problem (technical or personal).

An example (not meant to point fingers): A very long time ago, I was
asked to judge one of the CC historical masquerades by one of the
then-masquerade directors. I had planned to fulfil that role all the way
up to the con itself, only to discover a few months out that the
original director had dropped out of the committee, had not informed the
other director, and that the remaining director had chosen other judges.
I could have competed at the con, and could have made myself available
to assist others, but because I didn’t know about the switch in
directors, I had no way to follow up.

Publishing this information (and then correcting or updating it if
necessary) is generally a good thing, and something you may wish to
consider doing for the next PR. Certainly, with the web site (a flexible
publication) there should be no reason not to include the names of the
committee members along with the roles. A simple “we’re sorry – we had
to change the responsible parties – they are now…” statement is easy
to add to the site, and helps to limit potential confusion.

Just my own personal two cents, adjusted for inflation. Your mileage may
vary…

-Betsy

srabba wrote:

> — In runacc@yahoogroups.com, “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@s…>
> wrote:
>
>>We were just making an observation here: Each section
>
> says “contact the
>
>>director”, but there are no names? Who are they?
>
>
> The decision not to use names for the positions was a practical one.
> We’ve had several staff changes so far not to mention email and snail
> mail address changes for our staff. This sort of thing does happen
> and can even happen at this late date. By using titles for the
> contact information and the “whoever”@epicmovies.org as well as the
> convention address we can maintain continuity through out all our
> publications. This minimizes confusion as well as lost messages.
>
>
>>And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably,
>
> you’re
>
>>supposed to go to the website. Why?
>
>
> This PR contained the rules for the contests as published by the
> MDs. The weapons policies mentioned are those of that particular
> contest. It was not our intention to publish conference policy at
> this time. Each MD has the prerogative with the approval of ConCom
> to establish weapons guidelines appropriate to their venue. These
> guidelines may be more or less stringent than the conference policy.
> We will endeavor to make the conference weapon policy and indeed all
> conference policies as close as possible to those of the contests.
> However, we also recognize that there can be a different set of
> standards for on stage verses wandering the halls.
>
> There’s only so much information we can get out at one time. Space,
> time and money dictate much of those choices. We felt it was
> important to get out the contest rules at this time. Future
> publications will contain further information.
>
> Sallie Abba
> Co-Chair CC-24
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

—
—
Betsy Delaney
*************************************************************************
http://www.hawkeswood.com/ * http://www.OutOftheBlackBox.org/
http://www.BarkingMad.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
*************************************************************************

—– Original Message —–
From: “srabba” <gsabba@att.net>
> — In runacc@yahoogroups.com, “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@s…> wrote:
>> We were just making an observation here: Each section says “contact the
>> director”, but there are no names? Who are they?
> The decision not to use names for the positions was a practical one.
> We’ve had several staff changes so far not to mention email and snail
> mail address changes for our staff. This sort of thing does happen
> and can even happen at this late date. By using titles for the
> contact information and the “whoever”@epicmovies.org as well as the
> convention address we can maintain continuity through out all our
> publications. This minimizes confusion as well as lost messages.

More to the point – why weren’t the email addys under each “contact x”
statement rather than all grouped at the back? I know it’s redundant but I
didn’t realize they were even in the PR until I reached the end.

>> And there’s no stated convention weapons policy. Presumably, you’re
>> supposed to go to the website. Why?
> This PR contained the rules for the contests as published by the
> MDs. The weapons policies mentioned are those of that particular
> contest.
Which say (in essence) “see the convention policy” which isn’t in the PR.
That’s what we’re asking about specifically.

Nora

It occured to me that, beyond the flyers, newbies often don’t have a
complete picture of what to expect at a CC. So I wrote up these 3
documents, which I’ve uploaded to the runacc group.
The intentinois to send them with the PR(s) to anyone who identifies
themselves as a “first-timer”.

If anyone has any additions they’d like to suggest, I would welcome them –
especially the “Do’s and Don’ts”

Bruce

Bruce,

Where are the documents? I can only find the costumeconnections site.

Elaine

Nil significat nisi oscillat!

>From: “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@sbcglobal.net>
>Reply-To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: [runacc] Educatinal materials
>Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 09:57:34 -0600
>
>It occured to me that, beyond the flyers, newbies often don’t have a
>complete picture of what to expect at a CC. So I wrote up these 3
>documents, which I’ve uploaded to the runacc group.
>The intentinois to send them with the PR(s) to anyone who identifies
>themselves as a “first-timer”.
>
>If anyone has any additions they’d like to suggest, I would welcome them –
>especially the “Do’s and Don’ts”
>
>Bruce
>
>
>

Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:

> It occured to me that, beyond the flyers, newbies often don’t have a

complete picture of what to expect at a CC. So I wrote up these 3
documents, which I’ve uploaded to the runacc group.

> The intentinois to send them with the PR(s) to anyone who identifies

themselves as a “first-timer”.

> If anyone has any additions they’d like to suggest, I would welcome them

–

> especially the “Do’s and Don’ts”
>

Here’s the one I did for CC26, it includes a “hotel resume” section too.

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/CC26.Packet.pdf

andy

How come this information isn’t on the actual website? I know you don’t have
concrete information yet but I think even the general dates you mention, etc
would be helpful on the site itself.

Nora

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Educatinal materials

> Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:
>> It occured to me that, beyond the flyers, newbies often don’t have a
> complete picture of what to expect at a CC. So I wrote up these 3
> documents, which I’ve uploaded to the runacc group.
>> The intentinois to send them with the PR(s) to anyone who identifies
> themselves as a “first-timer”.
>> If anyone has any additions they’d like to suggest, I would welcome them
> –
>> especially the “Do’s and Don’ts”
>>
>
> Here’s the one I did for CC26, it includes a “hotel resume” section too.
>
> http://www.cc26.info/Posters/CC26.Packet.pdf
>
> andy
>
>
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>