We have collected a lot of info from our Visitor and Convention Bureau. It’s not all useful, but it does help.
Charles CC-23

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Monday, June 2, 2003, at 07:21 PM, henryosier@cs.com wrote:

> With a little modification, this would be a good thing to hand to the
> hotel
> staff so they know what we are all about.

That may just be a matter of writing up a “hotel info” sheet to include
for sales visits.

andy
—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
http://www.irlm.org/ – mailto:webmaster@irlm.org
“Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to”
— Donna Barr

Trust me, taking pictures from past Costume Cons (both S&S-F and
Historical Masquerades) to show to the hotels when you make your visits
can be very educational. Watch for the sales droids reactions and body
language. It can save you from signing with a property that will be
hostile to the convention once it gets there, and possibly point you to
a hotel that will be thrilled to have us.

Marty who’s been there and done that.

Andrew Trembley wrote:

> On Monday, June 2, 2003, at 07:21 PM, henryosier@cs.com wrote:
>
>>With a little modification, this would be a good thing to hand to the
>>hotel
>>staff so they know what we are all about.
>
> That may just be a matter of writing up a “hotel info” sheet to include
> for sales visits.
>
> andy

…or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?

I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
“Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better title).
It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and one
of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
“It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
–Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

read the FAQ… Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/
read the FAQ… IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/
read the FAQ… AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html
read the FAQ… Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf

take a look, give me your comments. This is the “pre-vote” packet.
First page is cover-letter, next two sides are marketing/campaign
report, last two sides are hotel introduction. Doesn’t include photo
portfolio pages.

Once we’ve got a hotel agreement, the marketing/campaign report will be
expanded, and the hotel introduction won’t be as important (and
obviously won’t be sent out to anybody but the hotel we’ve got). Post
vote expect more details on panels and other such things.

I’m running this by my hotel and marketing people too, of course…

andy

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

On Monday, June 2, 2003, at 03:53 PM, Andrew Trembley wrote:

> So what really needs to go into the packet?

1. A cover letter
2. A 2- or 4-side report with more detailed information about the
conference
3. A 2-side report tailored to hotel sales staff
4. A 1-4 page “portfolio” showing examples of masquerade and contest
entries
5. Copies of event fliers relevant to the organization

All can go into a simple pocket folder with the conference name and
logo stickered on to the front.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
http://www.bovil.com/
“It’s not pink; it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.” –Manfred Pfirsich
Marie Rommel

Not to my knowledge. The only one I know of that might have come close
to having trouble with paying the hotel was CC7, since I recall there
were a lot of financial issues with the Kennedys’ con. I think that CCs
which came after took the lessons of CC7 to heart and most or all came
out ahead in some way.

CCXV got stung at the end by problems with our hotel’s electric bill,
and so didn’t make as much as we expected to, and we had to pay for
video editing that wasn’t originally budgeted (which came directly out
of the income from the video sales), but we were still able to pass on
somewhere between two and three thousand dollars to future CCs.

-Betsy

Andrew T Trembley wrote:

>
> …or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
>
> meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?
>
> I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
> “Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better
> title).
> It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and
> one
> of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
> and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> (Kevin’s)
> “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Costume-Con Archivist
Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)

CC7 paid the hotel in full at the end of the con. The “financial trouble” was a result of Pat and Peggy writing a personal check to the hotel instead of a check on the con’s account! We then had the difficulty of justifying why a not-for-profit organization was paying a sizable sum to them.

No one on the committee knew what they had done until it was too late.

The CC7 treasurer (Tina) was not amused. The mere appearance of self-dealing between a not-for-profit corporation and its officers could lead to audit disallowances, revocation of recognition of tax-exempt status, and both civil and criminal prosecution. Fortunately, that didn’t happen in the case of CC7; the fiscal agent for the con was LASTsfa, the local science fiction club, of which Pat and Peggy were not even members (thank Ghod!). The lesson to be learned is that ALL members of the concom need to exercise self-discipline.

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Betsy Delaney
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…

Not to my knowledge. The only one I know of that might have come close
to having trouble with paying the hotel was CC7, since I recall there
were a lot of financial issues with the Kennedys’ con. I think that CCs
which came after took the lessons of CC7 to heart and most or all came
out ahead in some way.

CCXV got stung at the end by problems with our hotel’s electric bill,
and so didn’t make as much as we expected to, and we had to pay for
video editing that wasn’t originally budgeted (which came directly out
of the income from the video sales), but we were still able to pass on
somewhere between two and three thousand dollars to future CCs.

-Betsy

Andrew T Trembley wrote:
>
> …or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
>
> meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?
>
> I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
> “Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better
> title).
> It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and
> one
> of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
> and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> (Kevin’s)
> “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Costume-Con Archivist
Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Did CC17 have problems? I thought I remembered Rob Himmelsbach saying
something about financial problems with the hotel, but perhaps they got
settled out OK at the end.

Trudy

>From: “Byron Connell” <bconnel1@nycap.rr.com>
>Reply-To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…
>Date: Tue, 3 Jun 2003 21:20:25 -0400
>
>CC7 paid the hotel in full at the end of the con. The “financial trouble”
>was a result of Pat and Peggy writing a personal check to the hotel instead
>of a check on the con’s account! We then had the difficulty of justifying
>why a not-for-profit organization was paying a sizable sum to them.
>
>No one on the committee knew what they had done until it was too late.
>
>The CC7 treasurer (Tina) was not amused. The mere appearance of
>self-dealing between a not-for-profit corporation and its officers could
>lead to audit disallowances, revocation of recognition of tax-exempt
>status, and both civil and criminal prosecution. Fortunately, that didn’t
>happen in the case of CC7; the fiscal agent for the con was LASTsfa, the
>local science fiction club, of which Pat and Peggy were not even members
>(thank Ghod!). The lesson to be learned is that ALL members of the concom
>need to exercise self-discipline.
>
>Byron
>
>
>—– Original Message —–
> From: Betsy Delaney
> To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 8:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…
>
>
> Not to my knowledge. The only one I know of that might have come close
> to having trouble with paying the hotel was CC7, since I recall there
> were a lot of financial issues with the Kennedys’ con. I think that CCs
> which came after took the lessons of CC7 to heart and most or all came
> out ahead in some way.
>
> CCXV got stung at the end by problems with our hotel’s electric bill,
> and so didn’t make as much as we expected to, and we had to pay for
> video editing that wasn’t originally budgeted (which came directly out
> of the income from the video sales), but we were still able to pass on
> somewhere between two and three thousand dollars to future CCs.
>
> -Betsy
>
> Andrew T Trembley wrote:
> >
> > …or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
> >
> > meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?
> >
> > I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
> > “Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better
> > title).
> > It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and
> > one
> > of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
> > and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.
> >
> > —
> > andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> > San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> > (Kevin’s)
> > “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> > –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel
>
>
> —
> Betsy R. Delaney
> Costume-Con Archivist
> Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

_________________________________________________________________
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Byron, it was my understanding that the con was $$$$ over budget (mostly
due to the hotel bill), and that was why Pat & Peggy had to kick in their
personal funds…? But I was not on the committee and don’t know the whole
story.

–Karen

At 09:20 PM 6/3/2003 -0400, you wrote:

>CC7 paid the hotel in full at the end of the con. The “financial trouble”
>was a result of Pat and Peggy writing a personal check to the hotel
>instead of a check on the con’s account! We then had the difficulty of
>justifying why a not-for-profit organization was paying a sizable sum to them.
>
>No one on the committee knew what they had done until it was too late.
>
>The CC7 treasurer (Tina) was not amused. The mere appearance of
>self-dealing between a not-for-profit corporation and its officers could
>lead to audit disallowances, revocation of recognition of tax-exempt
>status, and both civil and criminal prosecution. Fortunately, that didn’t
>happen in the case of CC7; the fiscal agent for the con was LASTsfa, the
>local science fiction club, of which Pat and Peggy were not even members
>(thank Ghod!). The lesson to be learned is that ALL members of the concom
>need to exercise self-discipline.
>
>Byron
>
>
>—– Original Message —–
> From: Betsy Delaney
> To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 8:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…
>
>
> Not to my knowledge. The only one I know of that might have come close
> to having trouble with paying the hotel was CC7, since I recall there
> were a lot of financial issues with the Kennedys’ con. I think that CCs
> which came after took the lessons of CC7 to heart and most or all came
> out ahead in some way.
>
> CCXV got stung at the end by problems with our hotel’s electric bill,
> and so didn’t make as much as we expected to, and we had to pay for
> video editing that wasn’t originally budgeted (which came directly out
> of the income from the video sales), but we were still able to pass on
> somewhere between two and three thousand dollars to future CCs.
>
> -Betsy
>
> Andrew T Trembley wrote:
> >
> > …or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
> >
> > meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?
> >
> > I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
> > “Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better
> > title).
> > It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and
> > one
> > of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
> > and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.
> >
> > —
> > andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> > San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> > (Kevin’s)
> > “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> > –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel
>
>
> —
> Betsy R. Delaney
> Costume-Con Archivist
> Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Since I was probably closest to that one (aside from the dear departed – SIGH!) I think it is safe to say that the hotel got paid O.K., it was the Kennedy’s who took the hit. I don’t believe that the hotel had any inkling that there were financial issues, so there wouldn’t be anything in “the record” that would cause a problem that way for future CC’s.

The real problem there was that the hotel kept the housing and banquet departments separate. The banquet (i.e., function space) dept. didn’t really give a **** how many rooms we filled. They wanted their department’s budget to make a bundle, regardless. That’s something to look out for in doing a hotel search.

Tina

—– Original Message —–
From: Betsy Delaney
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…

Not to my knowledge. The only one I know of that might have come close
to having trouble with paying the hotel was CC7, since I recall there
were a lot of financial issues with the Kennedys’ con. I think that CCs
which came after took the lessons of CC7 to heart and most or all came
out ahead in some way.

CCXV got stung at the end by problems with our hotel’s electric bill,
and so didn’t make as much as we expected to, and we had to pay for
video editing that wasn’t originally budgeted (which came directly out
of the income from the video sales), but we were still able to pass on
somewhere between two and three thousand dollars to future CCs.

-Betsy

Andrew T Trembley wrote:
>
> …or not. Anybody know if any past Costume-Cons have had any problems
>
> meeting their financial obligations to the hotel?
>
> I’ve taken Marty and Henry’s comments to heart and am working on a
> “Costume-Con Venue Information Guide” (and looking for a better
> title).
> It’s based on the briefing list in the WorldCon runners’ guide, and
> one
> of the things they suggest emphasizing is the con’s financial history
> and creditworthiness in the eyes of hotels.
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> (Kevin’s)
> “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Costume-Con Archivist
Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Having the banquet and rooms sales separate seems to be the exception. Usually the hotels seem to have “sales and catering” which are very aware of the combined income of rooms and function space. The odd case of a hotel just opening seems to break those rules. They seem to have a sales agent that is willing to say anything, and then let the hotel sort it out later. Be cautious of deals that look “too good to be true” it that situation. This is just my local experience.
Charles
–

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf

I’ve made revisions. Still no portfolio pics, just the reports. I would
particularly like to hear what folks who have done hotel negotiations
have to say about the last two pages (venue information guide).

andy

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
http://www.irlm.org/ – mailto:webmaster@irlm.org
“Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to”
— Donna Barr

Unfortunately, that wasn’t true in New York’s Capital District at the time, nor, I believe, today. All our major hotels have split catering/functions as a separate profit center from rooms. This may be a local headache caused by demand for function space for events unrelated to the need for sleeping rooms that results from our government/academic/research economic mix, but other state capitals with similar needs might find similar hotel policies.

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Charles Galway
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…

Having the banquet and rooms sales separate seems to be the exception. Usually the hotels seem to have “sales and catering” which are very aware of the combined income of rooms and function space. The odd case of a hotel just opening seems to break those rules. They seem to have a sales agent that is willing to say anything, and then let the hotel sort it out later. Be cautious of deals that look “too good to be true” it that situation. This is just my local experience.
Charles

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I was just over on the Costume-Con site, compiling a list of designers
whose work has appeared in the Costume-Con Fashion Show over the last 21
years. This is part of a side project I am doing to try to track down all
these designers and get permissions (or definite refusals) to use the line
art for their designs next to the photos of the Fashion Show pieces
displayed on the CC website.

Anyway, since I was in and out of ALL the Fashion Show stuff in one sitting
tonight, I noticed a very interesting pattern in the number of participants
and felt I should comment on it here.

The Fashion Show was a very strong part of Costume-Con 1-11, with the
smallest show being 16 entries (CC-2), the largest show being 49 entries
(CC-8), and the average being around 28 entries (with 8 of the 11
conventions having Fashion Shows of 20+ entries).

The numbers drop DRAMATICALLY at Costume-Con 12 (from 24 entries in the
show the year before to only 9 entries at CC-12). They continue to be low
thoughout the next 8 Costume-Cons, with the smallest show being 4 (CC-19),
and the largest show being 14 (CC-15). I kept asking myself why the Fashion
Show would be so small, especially at CC-12 and CC-15, which were
well-attended cons in large cities.

Then it hit me. CC-12 was the first CC to try the Single Pattern Contest.
The dropping numbers in the Fashion Show indicate to me that CC attendees
have only so much time/energy/$$$ to devote to preparing for CC, so when
further competitions are added that require advance preparation (and are
run on the same day as the Fashion Show), the Fashion Show numbers suffer.

I don’t think Iron Costumer impacted CC-21 in quite the same way, as the
teams did not have to prepare anything in advance. [Although I would be
interested in hearing the Swopes’ comments on being on one of the teams for
Iron Costumer AND trying to compete in the Historical on the same
night(!).] [I also would STRONGLY suggest running Iron Costumer in a
different time slot so it does not impact the Historical Masquerade awards.]

CC-21’s Fashion Show, at a respectable 19 entries, was the largest in the
last 9 years.

Trudy, I know CC-22 is running a Single Pattern Contest, and you have
selected some really cool patterns. However, if there is any way to
schedule the modeling of items for the Single Pattern Contest so it is not
essentially in the same time slot as the Fashion Show, it might help to
increase participation in the Fashion Show. Just a thought.

–Karen

Andy —

While I can’t speak as someone who has been involved recently in hotel negotiations, generally speaking, I like the draft very much. Good job!

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Andrew Trembley
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Lance Moore
Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2003 8:57 PM
Subject: [runacc] Packet 0.2

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf

I’ve made revisions. Still no portfolio pics, just the reports. I would
particularly like to hear what folks who have done hotel negotiations
have to say about the last two pages (venue information guide).

andy

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen
http://www.irlm.org/ – mailto:webmaster@irlm.org
“Anybody who takes this seriously deserves to”
— Donna Barr

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Karen,

I have to agree with you on all points. It is impossible (or nearly so) to
enter the FFF and Single Pattern contest at the same time. Doing Iron
Costumer and competing in the Historical was also a real challenge. The
Swopes partially changed between events, and I just charged through without
changing. (We were on the same team.). Also, although we were directly
below the MC, I have practically no memory of any of the Historical awards,
because we were so totally concentrated in our event.

Elaine

> I was just over on the Costume-Con site, compiling a list of designers
> whose work has appeared in the Costume-Con Fashion Show over the last 21
> years. This is part of a side project I am doing to try to track down all
> these designers and get permissions (or definite refusals) to use the line
> art for their designs next to the photos of the Fashion Show pieces
> displayed on the CC website.
>
> Anyway, since I was in and out of ALL the Fashion Show stuff in one

sitting

> tonight, I noticed a very interesting pattern in the number of

participants

> and felt I should comment on it here.
>
> The Fashion Show was a very strong part of Costume-Con 1-11, with the
> smallest show being 16 entries (CC-2), the largest show being 49 entries
> (CC-8), and the average being around 28 entries (with 8 of the 11
> conventions having Fashion Shows of 20+ entries).
>
> The numbers drop DRAMATICALLY at Costume-Con 12 (from 24 entries in the
> show the year before to only 9 entries at CC-12). They continue to be low
> thoughout the next 8 Costume-Cons, with the smallest show being 4 (CC-19),
> and the largest show being 14 (CC-15). I kept asking myself why the

Fashion

> Show would be so small, especially at CC-12 and CC-15, which were
> well-attended cons in large cities.
>
> Then it hit me. CC-12 was the first CC to try the Single Pattern Contest.
> The dropping numbers in the Fashion Show indicate to me that CC attendees
> have only so much time/energy/$$$ to devote to preparing for CC, so when
> further competitions are added that require advance preparation (and are
> run on the same day as the Fashion Show), the Fashion Show numbers suffer.
>
> I don’t think Iron Costumer impacted CC-21 in quite the same way, as the
> teams did not have to prepare anything in advance. [Although I would be
> interested in hearing the Swopes’ comments on being on one of the teams

for

> Iron Costumer AND trying to compete in the Historical on the same
> night(!).] [I also would STRONGLY suggest running Iron Costumer in a
> different time slot so it does not impact the Historical Masquerade

awards.]

>
> CC-21’s Fashion Show, at a respectable 19 entries, was the largest in the
> last 9 years.
>
> Trudy, I know CC-22 is running a Single Pattern Contest, and you have
> selected some really cool patterns. However, if there is any way to
> schedule the modeling of items for the Single Pattern Contest so it is not
> essentially in the same time slot as the Fashion Show, it might help to
> increase participation in the Fashion Show. Just a thought.
>
> –Karen
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Nora and I did this at a CC. The Single Pattern contest was first (the
one with the Irish dress), followed immediately by the FFS. We had to
be scheduled early in the Single Pattern show so that we could change.
We ran back to the green room, literally stripped down to nothing, and
got our FFS outfits on. If a lot of people tried to do that, scheduling
everyone so that they would have enough time to change is doubtful.

Karen

Elaine wrote:

> Karen,
>
> I have to agree with you on all points. It is impossible (or nearly
> so) to
> enter the FFF and Single Pattern contest at the same time.

Since the Single Pattern Contest and Iron Costumer were both first produced
by me, I’m going to address them both in one response. My apologies for the
mild bits of ranting that will occur. There are many bits of strong and
not-so-humble opinion herein.

> Then it hit me. CC-12 was the first CC to try the Single Pattern Contest.
> The dropping numbers in the Fashion Show indicate to me that CC attendees
> have only so much time/energy/$$$ to devote to preparing for CC, so when
> further competitions are added that require advance preparation (and are
> run on the same day as the Fashion Show), the Fashion Show numbers suffer.

The SPC was started because for several years in a row I heard from people
who were afraid to make anything for the Future Fashion show because they
were afraid to try to draft the patterns.

CC-12 also very definitely restricted accepted designs for the FFF to
FASHION. If you review the FF show photos for the years immediately prior to
CC-12, you will note that there was a huge swing towards making the
“theatrical” designs in the folio. In other words, making a STAGE COSTUME
that didn’t have to compete in a masquerade. After having to follow the
“Goth Vampire Queen Elizabeth Opera Dress” (or whatever it was actually
called) on stage I was personally *sick to death* of having really cool
*fashion* being upstaged by stage diva chic. And I had also noticed a
disturbing sameness (to me) developing in the designs appearing in the
Folios in those years — there wasn’t a whole lot that felt *new* from year
to year.

This year I suggested to Pierre and Sandy a modified Single Pattern Contest:
that instead of having a competition of constructed garments, they roll the
SPC into the DESIGN contest that creates the folio. In other words, the
single pattern designs would go into the folio and any garments made from
those designs would be part of the regular Future Fashion Show. I came up
with the idea too late, but I offer it as a recommendation to other CCs. The
fear of scratch pattern drafting is a very real one; knowing what pattern a
design is based on could actually further increase participation in the
show.

So while there is definitely a synchronicity with CC 12, the single pattern
contest, and reduced number of FF designs being made, don’t discount the
fact that the content of the folio will also have a strong effect. (Also, at
CC12 we had the wearable art display as part of the runway show, too. All
three were combined and mixed into a single “Dimensions in Design” show on
Sunday — we put 40-odd designs down that runway in 45 minutes)

> night(!).] [I also would STRONGLY suggest running Iron Costumer in a
> different time slot so it does not impact the Historical Masquerade

awards.]

Now — as to this. I agree that we screwed up the impact of the historical
awards at I.C. Give me a break — no one had tried this as a real production
(meaning staged, narrated, the works) before.

I had thought we would actually be bringing the house lights down and stage
lights up for each of those commercial breaks, so that they would have far
greater dramatic impact. I failed to realize until too late that we would
need task lighting for the work tables to do that. In hindsight, the correct
decision would have been, as others have suggested, holding all the
historical awards until after Iron Costumer was finished.

As to finding another time slot: THERE WEREN’T ANY. The stage and tech were
not installed until Saturday, so we couldn’t do it as a Friday night
entertainment. Saturday afternoon was tech rehearsal for F&SF. Sunday day
was the Fashion Show. Sunday night was the Historical masquerade — and then
it occurred to me to ask if Nancy had any half-time entertainment scheduled.
She didn’t, and so I offered Iron Costumer as that entertainment.

For those who commented that IC seemed to be designed to keep everyone in
the room while the judges deliberated: duh. That’s what half-time
entertainment is SUPPOSED to do.
And for the record — we finished just as the judges returned with the final
awards.

OK, I’m off my soapbox now. Sorry for the rant.

Kevin

Karen –

If you don’t mind, I’m going to forward your comments on over to Nora Mai
who is running both the FFF and Single Pattern shows. We have not yet
settled on a time and day for them, although I know that Sunday is
traditional. I hate to admit that I haven’t even seen the Single Pattern
and FFF for the past couple of years. In Chicago, it was the same time as
when we were hosting the Con-suite, but I have noticed previously that the
numbers on both seemed to be dropping from the first CCs that we attended.
Thanks for your comments,

Trudy

>From: Ricky & Karen Dick <castleb@pulsenet.com>
>Reply-To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [runacc] Fashion Show
>Date: Wed, 04 Jun 2003 22:10:20 -0400
>
>I was just over on the Costume-Con site, compiling a list of designers
>whose work has appeared in the Costume-Con Fashion Show over the last 21
>years. This is part of a side project I am doing to try to track down all
>these designers and get permissions (or definite refusals) to use the line
>art for their designs next to the photos of the Fashion Show pieces
>displayed on the CC website.
>
>Anyway, since I was in and out of ALL the Fashion Show stuff in one sitting
>tonight, I noticed a very interesting pattern in the number of participants
>and felt I should comment on it here.
>
>The Fashion Show was a very strong part of Costume-Con 1-11, with the
>smallest show being 16 entries (CC-2), the largest show being 49 entries
>(CC-8), and the average being around 28 entries (with 8 of the 11
>conventions having Fashion Shows of 20+ entries).
>
>The numbers drop DRAMATICALLY at Costume-Con 12 (from 24 entries in the
>show the year before to only 9 entries at CC-12). They continue to be low
>thoughout the next 8 Costume-Cons, with the smallest show being 4 (CC-19),
>and the largest show being 14 (CC-15). I kept asking myself why the Fashion
>Show would be so small, especially at CC-12 and CC-15, which were
>well-attended cons in large cities.
>
>Then it hit me. CC-12 was the first CC to try the Single Pattern Contest.
>The dropping numbers in the Fashion Show indicate to me that CC attendees
>have only so much time/energy/$$$ to devote to preparing for CC, so when
>further competitions are added that require advance preparation (and are
>run on the same day as the Fashion Show), the Fashion Show numbers suffer.
>
>I don’t think Iron Costumer impacted CC-21 in quite the same way, as the
>teams did not have to prepare anything in advance. [Although I would be
>interested in hearing the Swopes’ comments on being on one of the teams for
>Iron Costumer AND trying to compete in the Historical on the same
>night(!).] [I also would STRONGLY suggest running Iron Costumer in a
>different time slot so it does not impact the Historical Masquerade
>awards.]
>
>CC-21’s Fashion Show, at a respectable 19 entries, was the largest in the
>last 9 years.
>
>Trudy, I know CC-22 is running a Single Pattern Contest, and you have
>selected some really cool patterns. However, if there is any way to
>schedule the modeling of items for the Single Pattern Contest so it is not
>essentially in the same time slot as the Fashion Show, it might help to
>increase participation in the Fashion Show. Just a thought.
>
>–Karen
>

_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

Kevin–

Wasn’t trying to pick on you or contests you started; just trying to figure
out whattheheck happened to the Fashion Show (which has been a personal
favorite of mine since I was attending cons in the early 70’s with Fashion
Shows run by Bjo Trimble) and figure out if there is some hope of fixing it.

At 11:32 PM 6/4/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>The SPC was started because for several years in a row I heard from people
>who were afraid to make anything for the Future Fashion show because they
>were afraid to try to draft the patterns.

That doesn’t explain why the Fashion Show numbers held so uniformly for 11
years and then dropped off. (It also doesn’t explain the large fashion
shows at the Equicons in the 70’s.) If people couldn’t draft patterns, it
should have been a problem from the beginning.

With so many costume patterns on the market now from Simplicity and other
sources, it seems to me that someone making a design for the Fashion Show
could find something *close* and go from there. A savvy designer might even
suggest potential patterns for someone wanting to make up the design.

Now that I think about it, I’m wondering if the Historical Masquerade is
impacting the Fashion Show as well, as the Historical has grown in size and
complexity (and pre-judging) over the years and more people are
participating in that.

>CC-12 also very definitely restricted accepted designs for the FFF to
>FASHION.

But Fashion always has included stage, theatrical, and ceremonial costume.

>If you review the FF show photos for the years immediately prior to
>CC-12, you will note that there was a huge swing towards making the
>”theatrical” designs in the folio. In other words, making a STAGE COSTUME
>that didn’t have to compete in a masquerade.

I think part of the appeal of the Fashion Show was that you could make a
cool costume that had ALREADY WON something on the strength of its design.
So there was no competition pressure.

And yes, there were some grandiose designs that got made up.

And some less overblown stuff that got made up as well.

>After having to follow the “Goth Vampire Queen Elizabeth Opera Dress” (or
>whatever it was actually called) on stage I was personally *sick to death*
>of having really cool
>*fashion* being upstaged by stage diva chic.

And fashion shows by real runway designers today have always included some
theatrical/grandiose designs (and presentations!) that were *never*
intended for street wear. Witness Thierry Mugler, Alexander McQueen, and
Jean Paul Gaultier. And the excessive Oscar de la Renta sows in the 80’s.

>And I had also noticed a disturbing sameness (to me) developing in the
>designs appearing in the
>Folios in those years — there wasn’t a whole lot that felt *new* from
>year to year.

There was a trend for designers to resubmit their designs that hadn’t made
it into the Folio in one year until they got in.

There was a dwindling pool of designers. The traditional designers were
going through Life stuff or whatever and not submitting new stuff, and the
FFF was not attracting new designers for whatever reason.

I haven’t gone through the actual Folios, but of the stuff that got made up
for the Fashion Show, only 123 designers are represented over 21 years.
That isn’t very many names, if you think about it. That means there’s a lot
of the same names participating from year to year.

>This year I suggested to Pierre and Sandy a modified Single Pattern Contest:
>that instead of having a competition of constructed garments, they roll the
>SPC into the DESIGN contest that creates the folio. In other words, the
>single pattern designs would go into the folio and any garments made from
>those designs would be part of the regular Future Fashion Show. I came up
>with the idea too late, but I offer it as a recommendation to other CCs. The
>fear of scratch pattern drafting is a very real one; knowing what pattern a
>design is based on could actually further increase participation in the
>show.

This is an interesting idea and worth pursuing.

Also sounds like CC could use some panels/workshops on scratch pattern
drafting so people can get over their fears and get on with making cool
costumes, LOL!

>All three were combined and mixed into a single “Dimensions in Design” show on
>Sunday — we put 40-odd designs down that runway in 45 minutes)

Ricky, playing Devil’s Advocate, says if there are 20+ costumes of *any*
variety on stage on Sunday afternoon, then I shouldn’t complain, so Trudy,
you should take his dissenting opinion under advisement as well…Maybe
people don’t care about the source of what’s on stage as long as it’s a
good show.

But, personally, I would like to see more participation in the Fashion
Show. And I freely admit I have been one of the laggards who hasn’t been
making anything lately.

>[Re Iron Costumer] I agree that we screwed up the impact of the historical
>awards at I.C. Give me a break — no one had tried this as a real production
>(meaning staged, narrated, the works) before.

Wasn’t your fault. I.C. had never been tried before. Only reason I’m
commenting on it is to try to figure out solutions for next time, because,
overall, I.C. was a hoot.

>As to finding another time slot: THERE WEREN’T ANY. The stage and tech were
>not installed until Saturday, so we couldn’t do it as a Friday night
>entertainment.

But maybe Friday Night might be a possibility at Future CC’s that care to
run I.C.?

Other events have been run successfully at the same time as the Social (I
think the original $1.98 competition was, and at least one “retro” Fashion
Show), so this is a possibility if the Social is being run in the same
ballroom space as the other staged events.

>OK, I’m off my soapbox now. Sorry for the rant.

Again, not picking on the events…just trying to figure out ways we can
have all these events and let as many people as possible participate in them.

–Karen

I’ve made a few changes to the text based on comments I’ve received,
and I’ve pulled a few pictures from the archives to make up sample
portfolio pages. If I can get permissions from folks, they may end up
being my final portfolio pages.

Warning: the PDF is pretty big now that the photos have been added, so
it may take a while to download if you’re on dial-up.
http://www.bovil.com/Posters/Packet.pdf

andy
—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

It’s not impossible. With a lot of green room help — and a little bit of luck — it can be done! The green room needs to know what the sequence of both sets of entries is and be prepared to assist in lightning changes. If I knew what was needed, I’d be willing to do it.

Otherwise, the FFS/SPC usually is a walk in the park for the green room crew.

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: Karen Heim
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2003 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Fashion Show

Nora and I did this at a CC. The Single Pattern contest was first (the
one with the Irish dress), followed immediately by the FFS. We had to
be scheduled early in the Single Pattern show so that we could change.
We ran back to the green room, literally stripped down to nothing, and
got our FFS outfits on. If a lot of people tried to do that, scheduling
everyone so that they would have enough time to change is doubtful.

Karen

Elaine wrote:

> Karen,
>
> I have to agree with you on all points. It is impossible (or nearly
> so) to
> enter the FFF and Single Pattern contest at the same time.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kevin,

After all of that, I still would enter I.C. again. It was a blast from
start to finish! The hungry hovering over select stacks-o-stuph before we
could begin grabbing, the fruitless search for a rotary cutter – which led
us to resort to an exacto knife, the feverish working with unfamiliar
machines…………….I loved it! PLEASE put me in for the next one!

Elaine

Blessed are we who can laugh at ourselves, for we shall always be amused!

> Since the Single Pattern Contest and Iron Costumer were both first

produced

> by me, I’m going to address them both in one response. My apologies for

the

> mild bits of ranting that will occur. There are many bits of strong and
> not-so-humble opinion herein.
>

Andy, I’m getting a “404 Not Found” for this URL.

???

–Karen

At 04:14 PM 6/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>Warning: the PDF is pretty big now that the photos have been added, so
>it may take a while to download if you’re on dial-up.
>http://www.bovil.com/Posters/Packet.pdf
>
>andy

On Thursday, June 5, 2003, at 08:18 PM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:

> Andy, I’m getting a “404 Not Found” for this URL.

That would be because I botched it…

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

At 09:10 PM 6/4/2003, you wrote:

Karen,

CC21’s not having a Single Pattern competition was largely because Sandy
and I strongly opposed it precisely because we thought it was having an
effect on Show entries. Also of concern was the lateness of many folios,
though I don’t have a list of release dates. That was one of the reasons we
were strongly committed to getting the folio out by mid-November to allow
everyone at least 5 months for construction.

Pierre

>I was just over on the Costume-Con site, compiling a list of designers
>whose work has appeared in the Costume-Con Fashion Show over the last 21
>years. This is part of a side project I am doing to try to track down all
>these designers and get permissions (or definite refusals) to use the line
>art for their designs next to the photos of the Fashion Show pieces
>displayed on the CC website.
>
>Anyway, since I was in and out of ALL the Fashion Show stuff in one sitting
>tonight, I noticed a very interesting pattern in the number of participants
>and felt I should comment on it here.
>
>The Fashion Show was a very strong part of Costume-Con 1-11, with the
>smallest show being 16 entries (CC-2), the largest show being 49 entries
>(CC-8), and the average being around 28 entries (with 8 of the 11
>conventions having Fashion Shows of 20+ entries).
>
>The numbers drop DRAMATICALLY at Costume-Con 12 (from 24 entries in the
>show the year before to only 9 entries at CC-12). They continue to be low
>thoughout the next 8 Costume-Cons, with the smallest show being 4 (CC-19),
>and the largest show being 14 (CC-15). I kept asking myself why the Fashion
>Show would be so small, especially at CC-12 and CC-15, which were
>well-attended cons in large cities.
>
>Then it hit me. CC-12 was the first CC to try the Single Pattern Contest.
>The dropping numbers in the Fashion Show indicate to me that CC attendees
>have only so much time/energy/$$$ to devote to preparing for CC, so when
>further competitions are added that require advance preparation (and are
>run on the same day as the Fashion Show), the Fashion Show numbers suffer.
>
>I don’t think Iron Costumer impacted CC-21 in quite the same way, as the
>teams did not have to prepare anything in advance. [Although I would be
>interested in hearing the Swopes’ comments on being on one of the teams for
>Iron Costumer AND trying to compete in the Historical on the same
>night(!).] [I also would STRONGLY suggest running Iron Costumer in a
>different time slot so it does not impact the Historical Masquerade awards.]
>
>CC-21’s Fashion Show, at a respectable 19 entries, was the largest in the
>last 9 years.
>
>Trudy, I know CC-22 is running a Single Pattern Contest, and you have
>selected some really cool patterns. However, if there is any way to
>schedule the modeling of items for the Single Pattern Contest so it is not
>essentially in the same time slot as the Fashion Show, it might help to
>increase participation in the Fashion Show. Just a thought.
>
>–Karen

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed To Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly–
Why They Are Simply Doomed.”

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

At 05:01 PM 6/5/2003 -0500, you wrote:

>CC21’s not having a Single Pattern competition was largely because Sandy
>and I strongly opposed it precisely because we thought it was having an
>effect on Show entries.

And CC-21’s Fashion Show was the strongest in the last 10 years. Good work!

I like the Single Pattern Contest, but we need to find a way to not have it
impact the Fashion Show so badly.

–Karen

Andy–

Looks good!

Two very minor corrections:

Forgot to note the page number, but Costume-Con 1 was held in 1983, not 1982.

And on the page showing examples of Historical costume (pg .7?), it says
CC_15 in St. Louis, MO. Should be CC-16.

This took FOREVER to load on my pitiful dial-up connection. Had to leave
the room and go watch TV for awhile, LOL!

–Karen

At 09:54 PM 6/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>On Thursday, June 5, 2003, at 08:18 PM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:
>
> > Andy, I’m getting a “404 Not Found” for this URL.
>
>That would be because I botched it…
>
>http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf
>
>
>–
>andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
>San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
>(Kevin’s)
>…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

On Thursday, June 5, 2003, at 11:15 PM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:

> Forgot to note the page number, but Costume-Con 1 was held in 1983,
> not 1982.

Got it. 2 spots.

> And on the page showing examples of Historical costume (pg .7?), it
> says
> CC_15 in St. Louis, MO. Should be CC-16.

Either I corrected this before you sent me this message, or one of us
was hallucinating.

> This took FOREVER to load on my pitiful dial-up connection. Had to
> leave
> the room and go watch TV for awhile, LOL!

This packet is intended only for print distribution, so I’m not worried
about the size or download time.

andy

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
“It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
–Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

2nd most important safety device on my bike: the one beneath my right
hand
Most important safety device on my bike: the one inside my helmet

OK. If we just eliminate sleeping and bathroom breaks
altogether…………….

Elaine

Blessed are we who can laugh at ourselves, for we shall always be amused!

>
> I like the Single Pattern Contest, but we need to find a way to not have

it

> impact the Fashion Show so badly.
>

At 08:16 PM 6/6/2003, you wrote:

>OK. If we just eliminate sleeping and bathroom breaks
>altogether…………….

You mean you haven’t got that down yet?

Pierre and Sandy

>Elaine
>
>Blessed are we who can laugh at ourselves, for we shall always be amused!
> >
> > I like the Single Pattern Contest, but we need to find a way to not have
>it
> > impact the Fashion Show so badly.
> >
>
>
>
>View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

“Those Who Fail To Learn History
Are Doomed To Repeat It;
Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly–
Why They Are Simply Doomed.”

Achemdro’hm
“The Illusion of Historical Fact”
— C.Y. 4971

Andromeda

Well, I have learned to sleep in the bathroom. It’s a start.

Elaine

> At 08:16 PM 6/6/2003, you wrote:
> >OK. If we just eliminate sleeping and bathroom breaks
> >altogether…………….
>
>
> You mean you haven’t got that down yet?
>
> Pierre and Sandy

CC17 was one of the conventions which passed a donation on to us from its
profits, so I would have to assume that their hotel bill was covered.

Eileen

—–Original Message—–
From: Trudy Leonard

Did CC17 have problems? I thought I remembered Rob Himmelsbach saying
something about financial problems with the hotel, but perhaps they got
settled out OK at the end.

Trudy

Then I think that pretty much answers the question: No, we’ve never had
a hotel that didn’t get paid. It just cost us more than we budgeted for
on a number of occasions. Now we just need to identify what happened, so
we can try to stop the problem from happening again in the future.

Agreed?

Cheers,

Betsy

Cliff and Eileen wrote:

>
> CC17 was one of the conventions which passed a donation on to us from
> its
> profits, so I would have to assume that their hotel bill was covered.
>
> Eileen

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Costume-Con Archivist
Costume-ConNections (http://www.Costume-Con.org/)

On Tuesday, June 10, 2003, at 01:42 PM, Betsy Delaney wrote:

> Then I think that pretty much answers the question: No, we’ve never had
> a hotel that didn’t get paid. It just cost us more than we budgeted for
> on a number of occasions. Now we just need to identify what happened,
> so
> we can try to stop the problem from happening again in the future.

I added (if you haven’t looked recently) a paragraph about how CC’s are
run by different groups but what we all have in common has been a
history of fiscal responsibility, and creditworthiness. Glad to hear
that if anybody decides to check up on it, we’re in the clear.

http://www.cc26.info/Posters/Packet.pdf
(warning, 7.6mb file, will take long time to download over dial-up)

andy

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

A new “Gotcha!” to look out for. Hotels have started charging a
“service charge” (around 15%) on the rental for the function space, and
they are hiding it in some part of the agreement that is not directly
related to the function space charges. You may be able to negotiate it
away or at least a smaller percentage as you are also going to be
charged for set-ups beyond the initial one, but even if you can’t get
rid of it, you had better be prepared for it in your budgeting. This
has just become prevalent in the past couple of years.

Marty

Betsy Delaney wrote:

>Then I think that pretty much answers the question: No, we’ve never had
>a hotel that didn’t get paid. It just cost us more than we budgeted for
>on a number of occasions. Now we just need to identify what happened, so
>we can try to stop the problem from happening again in the future.
>
>Agreed?
>
>

Service charges became common in Iowa quite some time ago. Currently
the range from 18% – 21%. You need to add up all of the costs: base
price, service charge, and sales tax when figuring out what your hotel
is costing you.

Les

On Tuesday, June 10, 2003, at 04:26 PM, martingear wrote:

> A new “Gotcha!” to look out for. Hotels have started charging a
> “service charge” (around 15%) on the rental for the function space, and
> they are hiding it in some part of the agreement that is not directly
> related to the function space charges. You may be able to negotiate it
> away or at least a smaller percentage as you are also going to be
> charged for set-ups beyond the initial one, but even if you can’t get
> rid of it, you had better be prepared for it in your budgeting. This
> has just become prevalent in the past couple of years.
>
> Marty
>
> Betsy Delaney wrote:
>
>> Then I think that pretty much answers the question: No, we’ve never
>> had
>> a hotel that didn’t get paid. It just cost us more than we budgeted
>> for
>> on a number of occasions. Now we just need to identify what happened,
>> so
>> we can try to stop the problem from happening again in the future.
>>
>> Agreed?
>>
>>
>
>
> ———————— Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ———————~–>
> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life’s Important
> Questions.
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/xX1wlB/TM
> ———————————————————————
> ~->
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
Les

—

Live, never to be ashamed if everything you do is published around the
world. Even if what is published is not true. — Richard Bach

We really do need to build the Tucker Inn!

Byron

—– Original Message —–
From: martingear
To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2003 5:26 PM
Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…

A new “Gotcha!” to look out for. Hotels have started charging a
“service charge” (around 15%) on the rental for the function space, and
they are hiding it in some part of the agreement that is not directly
related to the function space charges. You may be able to negotiate it
away or at least a smaller percentage as you are also going to be
charged for set-ups beyond the initial one, but even if you can’t get
rid of it, you had better be prepared for it in your budgeting. This
has just become prevalent in the past couple of years.

Marty

Betsy Delaney wrote:

>Then I think that pretty much answers the question: No, we’ve never had
>a hotel that didn’t get paid. It just cost us more than we budgeted for
>on a number of occasions. Now we just need to identify what happened, so
>we can try to stop the problem from happening again in the future.
>
>Agreed?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Tuesday, June 10, 2003, at 02:26 PM, martingear wrote:

> A new “Gotcha!” to look out for. Hotels have started charging a
> “service charge” (around 15%) on the rental for the function space, and
> they are hiding it in some part of the agreement that is not directly
> related to the function space charges. You may be able to negotiate it
> away or at least a smaller percentage as you are also going to be
> charged for set-ups beyond the initial one, but even if you can’t get
> rid of it, you had better be prepared for it in your budgeting. This
> has just become prevalent in the past couple of years.

Well, (and maybe I’m naive) it would be worth getting the hotel to sign
off on a spreadsheet that details all line items including service
charges before signing the final contract. If they sign off and say
there are no service charges, it’s great grounds to have the service
charges stricken from whatever areas they’re hidden in, or ammo to push
the salescritter on other areas if he won’t give up the service charges.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
“It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
–Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

read the FAQ… Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/
read the FAQ… IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/
read the FAQ… AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html
read the FAQ… Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/

Re-reading this, I recall we sent money to the next 3 CCs. We felt and
obligation, since CC15 had sent us (16) some seed money, as I recall.

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: “Cliff and Eileen” <capsam@nucleus.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2003 11:22 PM
Subject: RE: [runacc] Venue question…

> CC17 was one of the conventions which passed a donation on to us from its
> profits, so I would have to assume that their hotel bill was covered.
>
> Eileen
>
> —–Original Message—–
> From: Trudy Leonard
>
> Did CC17 have problems? I thought I remembered Rob Himmelsbach saying
> something about financial problems with the hotel, but perhaps they got
> settled out OK at the end.
>
> Trudy
>
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

We (CC22) received funds from Calgary. Thanks again, guys.

Trudy

>From: “Bruce & Nora Mai” <casamai@sbcglobal.net>
>Reply-To: runacc@yahoogroups.com
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [runacc] Venue question…
>Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 19:33:25 -0500
>
>Re-reading this, I recall we sent money to the next 3 CCs. We felt and
>obligation, since CC15 had sent us (16) some seed money, as I recall.
>
>Bruce
>
>—– Original Message —–
>From: “Cliff and Eileen” <capsam@nucleus.com>
>To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Monday, June 09, 2003 11:22 PM
>Subject: RE: [runacc] Venue question…
>
>
> > CC17 was one of the conventions which passed a donation on to us from
>its
> > profits, so I would have to assume that their hotel bill was covered.
> >
> > Eileen
> >
> > —–Original Message—–
> > From: Trudy Leonard
> >
> > Did CC17 have problems? I thought I remembered Rob Himmelsbach saying
> > something about financial problems with the hotel, but perhaps they got
> > settled out OK at the end.
> >
> > Trudy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>

_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

CCXV sent money (whatever was remaining after paying all bills and
refunding memberships to staff who wished the refunds) to CC16, CC17 and
CC18. As soon as the checks were cashed, and our bank balance was zero,
we closed our bank account and our books. It was the final act in
bookkeeping.

We divided the total amount between the three, roughly evenly.

I don’t know how long the practice continued after CCXV, but it only
made sense to me, since our books were entirely separate from the
GCFCG’s, and we didn’t want to muddy the bookkeeping waters for them,
after the accounting mess from CC3. As we got no cash from the chapter
at all, it seemed the logical thing to do, to keep it in the CC family.

Just an FYI.

Betsy

Bruce & Nora Mai wrote:

>
> Re-reading this, I recall we sent money to the next 3 CCs. We felt and
> obligation, since CC15 had sent us (16) some seed money, as I recall.
>
> Bruce
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Cliff and Eileen” <capsam@nucleus.com>
> To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, June 09, 2003 11:22 PM
> Subject: RE: [runacc] Venue question…
>
> > CC17 was one of the conventions which passed a donation on to us from its
> > profits, so I would have to assume that their hotel bill was covered.
> >
> > Eileen
> >
> > —–Original Message—–
> > From: Trudy Leonard
> >
> > Did CC17 have problems? I thought I remembered Rob Himmelsbach saying
> > something about financial problems with the hotel, but perhaps they got
> > settled out OK at the end.
> >
> > Trudy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Web Mistress at large

************************************************************************
http://www.WebInvent.com/ * http://www.hawkeswood.com/
http://www.Costume-Con.org/ * http://www.sickpups.org/
http://www.SchoolWithoutWalls.org/
************************************************************************

So this discussion of pass-forward funds has got me thinking…

(between the discussion of CC’s that have passed forward and reading in
my last TorCon PR where they said that they’ve received their
pass-forward funds from ChiCon2k, MilPhil and ConJose)

WorldCon committees commonly have budget line-items for estimated
pass-forward funds to successive cons. Also budget line-items for
membership reimbursements. This allows them to set goals for
pass-forward funds, and gives them a bit of cushion should membership
forecasts go drastically wrong.

Granted, I’ve only seen CCXV’s budget spreadsheets (because that’s all
that’s posted) so this may have started happening in CC budgets
already. If it hasn’t, I think it should. We should be setting goals
for pass-forward funds.

On a tangent, I would like to suggest that we include in the
pass-forward funds a line item to support the Costumers’ Suite at
WorldCon. This is not a convention-run activity. It’s rarely even a
convention-supported activity.

The Costumers’ Suite is (or at least should be) and “embassy to fandom”
for the costume community at WorldCon, and (if well-run) a great venue
to promote Costume-Con. I’m kind of concerned that at TorCon it’s going
to be shuffled off to some hotel other than the main hospitality hotel,
primarily for budget reasons. That’s not something that can be fixed
this year, but it’s something we could help avoid in the future.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
“It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
–Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel

read the FAQ… Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/
read the FAQ… IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/
read the FAQ… AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html
read the FAQ… Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/

Uhhhh, Andy, while your ideas are good ones, I’m not real comfortable with
setting “goals” in budgets for what you mention below. Beyond the whole
notion of appearing like having to make a profit (doesnt’ mean we have to be
poor), Things are usually too dicey money-wise , and I don’t want other
cons to feel pressured that they have to make some sort of goal. I’d rather
con-coms make their own decisions.as to how much to give. Expectations
might become an issue.

Bruce

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 7:58 PM
Subject: [runacc] pass-forward funds…

> So this discussion of pass-forward funds has got me thinking…
>
> (between the discussion of CC’s that have passed forward and reading in
> my last TorCon PR where they said that they’ve received their
> pass-forward funds from ChiCon2k, MilPhil and ConJose)
>
> WorldCon committees commonly have budget line-items for estimated
> pass-forward funds to successive cons. Also budget line-items for
> membership reimbursements. This allows them to set goals for
> pass-forward funds, and gives them a bit of cushion should membership
> forecasts go drastically wrong.
>
> Granted, I’ve only seen CCXV’s budget spreadsheets (because that’s all
> that’s posted) so this may have started happening in CC budgets
> already. If it hasn’t, I think it should. We should be setting goals
> for pass-forward funds.
>
> On a tangent, I would like to suggest that we include in the
> pass-forward funds a line item to support the Costumers’ Suite at
> WorldCon. This is not a convention-run activity. It’s rarely even a
> convention-supported activity.
>
> The Costumers’ Suite is (or at least should be) and “embassy to fandom”
> for the costume community at WorldCon, and (if well-run) a great venue
> to promote Costume-Con. I’m kind of concerned that at TorCon it’s going
> to be shuffled off to some hotel other than the main hospitality hotel,
> primarily for budget reasons. That’s not something that can be fixed
> this year, but it’s something we could help avoid in the future.
>
> —
> andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> (Kevin’s)
> “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel
>
> read the FAQ… Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/
> read the FAQ… IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/
> read the FAQ… AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html
> read the FAQ… Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

At 05:58 PM 6/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>We should be setting goals for pass-forward funds.

As CC founder/owner, I don’t think it is prudent to mandate pass-forward funds.

Many CC’s have had NO excess funds after the convention.

Others have chosen to use excess funds for other items benefitting their
own membership, such as CC-6’s Memory Book, which was compiled and mailed
to its members after the convention.

I think there can be some language about suggested ways of using excess
funds, including, but not limited to pass-along funds, but I am STRONGLY
opposed to anything else. As each committee is financially responsible for
their own CC, good or bad, it is NOT OUR BUSINESS to be telling them what
to do with their money. They earned it–it is up to them to decide what to
do with it. Period. If they choose to help out another CC that’s in
financial trouble, or pass forward funds to one or more future CC’s, that’s
really nice, but we cannot force them to do it.

>On a tangent, I would like to suggest that we include in the
>pass-forward funds a line item to support the Costumers’ Suite at
>WorldCon. This is not a convention-run activity. It’s rarely even a
>convention-supported activity.

Andy, I think we need to be taking care of our own business before we are
mandating ANYTHING having to do with WorldCon. Costume-Cons draw most of
their membership from the locality they are held in, with maybe two dozen
people following CC around the country. Therefore, the needs of a
Costume-Con in Moose Crotch, MN are probably NOT filled by sponsoring a
con suite at a WorldCon in Dallas, TX or Miami, FL. [If WorldCon was in
Minneapolis, maybe…]

Also, after 20 years, Costume-Con is still a VERY small convention,
probably averaging 300 members (with highs around 800 and lows around 150).
You are asking for inclusion of budgetary line items better suited for a
large regional. That’s just not practical or affordable for Costume-Con.

>The Costumers’ Suite is (or at least should be) and “embassy to fandom”
>for the costume community at WorldCon, and (if well-run) a great venue
>to promote Costume-Con.

WorldCon is not the be-all and end-all of promoting costuming. We’d be
better off doing “grassroots” marketing (or sponsoring parties) at
conventions in the same geographic area as an upcoming Costume-Con. For
example, I’m pretty sure in stating that CC-22 will probably have more of
its membership derived from the attendees of DragonCon than TorCon.

>I’m kind of concerned that at TorCon it’s going to be shuffled off to some
>hotel other than the main hospitality hotel, primarily for budget reasons.
>That’s not something that can be fixed
>this year, but it’s something we could help avoid in the future.

Andy, plain and simple, Costume-Con cannot afford to be the one “upgrading”
the Costumer’s Suite to the hotel *you* think it should be in. If you want
to pay for it out of your own funds, that’s fine, but Costume-Con doesn’t
have that kind of deep pockets.

I hope I am making myself crystal clear here.

–Karen

I agree. That should be listed (if at all) as a good thing to do, but don’t
lose sight of other needs in the meantime.
Elaine
“Sit potentia tecum”
…..Yoda

> Uhhhh, Andy, while your ideas are good ones, I’m not real comfortable with
> setting “goals” in budgets for what you mention below. Beyond the whole
> notion of appearing like having to make a profit (doesnt’ mean we have to

be

> poor), Things are usually too dicey money-wise , and I don’t want other
> cons to feel pressured that they have to make some sort of goal. I’d

rather

> con-coms make their own decisions.as to how much to give. Expectations
> might become an issue.
>
> Bruce
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Andrew Trembley” <attrembl@bovil.com>
> To: <runacc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 7:58 PM
> Subject: [runacc] pass-forward funds…
>
>
> > So this discussion of pass-forward funds has got me thinking…
> >
> > (between the discussion of CC’s that have passed forward and reading in
> > my last TorCon PR where they said that they’ve received their
> > pass-forward funds from ChiCon2k, MilPhil and ConJose)
> >
> > WorldCon committees commonly have budget line-items for estimated
> > pass-forward funds to successive cons. Also budget line-items for
> > membership reimbursements. This allows them to set goals for
> > pass-forward funds, and gives them a bit of cushion should membership
> > forecasts go drastically wrong.
> >
> > Granted, I’ve only seen CCXV’s budget spreadsheets (because that’s all
> > that’s posted) so this may have started happening in CC budgets
> > already. If it hasn’t, I think it should. We should be setting goals
> > for pass-forward funds.
> >
> > On a tangent, I would like to suggest that we include in the
> > pass-forward funds a line item to support the Costumers’ Suite at
> > WorldCon. This is not a convention-run activity. It’s rarely even a
> > convention-supported activity.
> >
> > The Costumers’ Suite is (or at least should be) and “embassy to fandom”
> > for the costume community at WorldCon, and (if well-run) a great venue
> > to promote Costume-Con. I’m kind of concerned that at TorCon it’s going
> > to be shuffled off to some hotel other than the main hospitality hotel,
> > primarily for budget reasons. That’s not something that can be fixed
> > this year, but it’s something we could help avoid in the future.
> >
> > —
> > andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
> > San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
> > (Kevin’s)
> > “It’s not pink, it’s peach-colored. Pink is tacky.”
> > –Manfred Pfirsich Marie Rommel
> >
> > read the FAQ… Ridicule: http://www.idiots-r-us.org/
> > read the FAQ… IBMWR: http://www.ibmwr.org/faq-files/
> > read the FAQ… AirList: http://www.airheads.org/faq.html
> > read the FAQ… Hoaxes & Urban Legends: http://urbanlegends.about.com/
> >
> >
> >
> > View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

> >
> >
>
>
>
> View the Document: http://www.Costume-Con.org/procedure/runacc/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> runacc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

On Tuesday, June 24, 2003, at 07:27 AM, Ricky & Karen Dick wrote:

> At 05:58 PM 6/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>> We should be setting goals for pass-forward funds.
>
> As CC founder/owner, I don’t think it is prudent to mandate
> pass-forward funds.

I was imprecise in my phrasing. The “we” I’m speaking of here is “we
concom members,” not “we RunACC folks.” I agree that pass-forward funds
should not be mandated by the constitution or guide.

If a convention committee wishes to give pass-forward funds or do
something else “for the public benefit” it’s a good idea to define
those as line items in the convention’s budget. That makes it much more
likely that such funds will exist when the con is over, and provides a
bit of cushion where the budget can be cut if something drastic happens.

>> On a tangent, I would like to suggest that we include in the
>> pass-forward funds a line item to support the Costumers’ Suite at
>> WorldCon. This is not a convention-run activity. It’s rarely even a
>> convention-supported activity.
>
> Andy, I think we need to be taking care of our own business before we
> are
> mandating ANYTHING having to do with WorldCon.

Again, I’m sorry if I made it look like I’m suggesting mandating
something here. I was thinking more in terms of including it in a list
of uses of “public benefit funds” that concoms could look to for
guidance.

> Costume-Cons draw most of
> their membership from the locality they are held in, with maybe two
> dozen
> people following CC around the country.

I’d set that number a bit higher, 50-100 folks who attend 3-4
Costume-Cons within a 5 year period.

> Therefore, the needs of a
> Costume-Con in Moose Crotch, MN are probably NOT filled by sponsoring
> a
> con suite at a WorldCon in Dallas, TX or Miami, FL. [If WorldCon was in
> Minneapolis, maybe…]

This is true, but it’s also a matter of perspective. There are a lot of
myths and urban legends floating around about Costume-Con, and WorldCon
is not a bad place to address them. There are a lot of costume fans
that travel to every WorldCon, and many of them could afford to travel
to Costume-Con too.

From a purely selfish perspective, it’s the folks who are done who are
giving the donation. They’re probably not bidding another CC for a few
years, so it doesn’t matter to them if they’re supporting something a
continent away.

> Also, after 20 years, Costume-Con is still a VERY small convention,
> probably averaging 300 members (with highs around 800 and lows around
> 150).

It’s hard to make numbers on this; there are so many “?”
membership/attendance figures in the published timeline. I do notice in
the first decade that when CC was in a major metro area memberships
were often above 400, and afterwards it dropped more to the 200 member
range in the same sorts of areas at least from the numbers I can read
or estimate from memory.

> You are asking for inclusion of budgetary line items better suited for
> a
> large regional. That’s just not practical or affordable for
> Costume-Con.

I don’t agree. We’re not talking $20k line items like a WorldCon; we’re
talking $250-500 line items (or whatever the concom thinks is prudent).

>> The Costumers’ Suite is (or at least should be) and “embassy to
>> fandom”
>> for the costume community at WorldCon, and (if well-run) a great venue
>> to promote Costume-Con.
>
> WorldCon is not the be-all and end-all of promoting costuming. We’d be
> better off doing “grassroots” marketing (or sponsoring parties) at
> conventions in the same geographic area as an upcoming Costume-Con. For
> example, I’m pretty sure in stating that CC-22 will probably have more
> of
> its membership derived from the attendees of DragonCon than TorCon.

I’m way ahead of you here. We’re working heavily with local
conventions, hosting parties here and at the cons we travel to. In the
last year we put in an appearance at last year’s Fanime. were landlords
for Costumers’ Suite at ConJose, hosted ConSuite at CC21, and hosted
parties at SiliCon, YaoiCon, FurtherConfusion, Gallifrey (LA), DemiCon
(Des Moines) and BayCon, WesterCon is coming up July 4 weekend, and
we’re going to be having a party there too.

We’re looking beyond the fannish costuming community, though.

We’ve got plans in place to heavily promote within the historical
reenactment organizations and other costume groups. We’ve got 3
imperial coronations and 2 ducal coronations in the Bay Area that we
can walk at as an “in-town organization.” That’s just the beginning of
non-fannish outreach.

>> I’m kind of concerned that at TorCon it’s going to be shuffled off to
>> some
>> hotel other than the main hospitality hotel, primarily for budget
>> reasons.
>> That’s not something that can be fixed
>> this year, but it’s something we could help avoid in the future.
>
> Andy, plain and simple, Costume-Con cannot afford to be the one
> “upgrading”
> the Costumer’s Suite to the hotel *you* think it should be in. If you
> want
> to pay for it out of your own funds, that’s fine, but Costume-Con
> doesn’t
> have that kind of deep pockets.

I’m doing my part.

Last year my Fairmont bill was $3k. I got some donations from folks,
but most of the cost of the Costumers’ Suite at ConJose came out of my
pocket.

This year Kevin and I have committed (I think) C$300 to the suite (cost
of 1 night) and we will continue to support the suite at WorldCons in
the future.

I agree that this kind of thing is something that not every CC could
afford, and not every CC would choose to do, but I still think it’s
something worth keeping on the radar.

—
andy trembley, Bitchy Design Queen – http://www.bovil.com/
San Jose, CA – ’72 R75/5 ’86 R100 (mine) – ’92 K75sa ’03 R1150R
(Kevin’s)
…remaining .sig trimmed for better message/.sig ratio

If the amount to be passed forward to future conventions is a budgeted
amount that a committee tries to meet, there is the possibility that at some
point a convention might have to hold back or even cut spending on extras to
make sure the targeted donations are made.

I would argue that a committee’s first responsibility is to the members who
have paid to support that committee’s convention. It is nice to be able to
pass on any funding that wasn’t needed to other committees, but they should
come last.

If the society formed to hold a CC intends to continue to exist after the CC
is over, the committee may choose to set a policy about how much it may pass
forward, conditional on a profit being made. However I don’t think the
possibility should be allowed to influence decisions about the current CC.
(If a society intends to dissolve after the convention, then all remaining
funds will need to be passed on to someone, regardless of whether there was
a budgeted amount or not.)

Eileen Capes

—–Original Message—–
From: Andrew Trembley

If a convention committee wishes to give pass-forward funds or do
something else “for the public benefit” it’s a good idea to define
those as line items in the convention’s budget. That makes it much more
likely that such funds will exist when the con is over, and provides a
bit of cushion where the budget can be cut if something drastic happens.

Hi, folks!

I want to clarify something concerning CCXV’s passthrough funds, sent to
CCs 16, 17 and 18:

The decision to clean out the bank account at the conclusion of payment
of everyone was made by the committee, with my primary influence. Our
sponsor, the GCFCG, provided us with a 501(c)(3) umbrella, but no
operating funds whatsoever. While a few of the GCFCG members argued that
we should keep the funds, it was my belief that the funds should be put
back into Costume-Cons, and since I was hearing that the next few were
lower in number than ours was, they could probably use the extra cash. I
was also President of the chapter at the time, and it was finally an
executive decision made to disperse the funds.

We didn’t have a mandate to do so. I think we received a donation from
at least one prior CC, which is where I got the idea to do it. I’d have
to look up the details to know which one gave it to us, but I think it
was one of the CA CCs. The main thing was, we wanted to zero out our
bank account.

History Lesson: The GCFCG had a big problem at the time the ICG was
incorporated (just prior to 1992), because of its original status as the
founding ICG chapter as well as sponsor of CC3. The con made so much
extra money, the IRS had a problem believing the chapter was non-profit.
It took years (and an expensive accountant bill) to straighten out the
finances as a result.

We didn’t want to cause any questions to happen with the IRS. The con
pulled in just over 20k over the entire course of its existence, but not
all in the same year, and we very carefully documented where every penny
went.

I had hoped to start a tradition, but I don’t know how long it lasted. I
know that at least CC16 passed on some funds, and I understand that CC19
did as well. Without the financial records/budgets from the other CCs, I
don’t know for sure what happened with the rest.

If we do address the subject in the Run a CC document, it should be as
historic data (what other con coms have done) and not as a requirement.
We certainly didn’t budget for the funds. I was hoping there would be
more, but an expensive hotel bill and extra video editing requirements
put paid to the largest quantity of profits. We were lucky we had the
extra to pass forward, in the end.

Note: I’m finishing with putting the Summer issue of The ICG Newsletter
sometime this weekend/early next week. I just finished labeling all the
envelopes – now have to collate and fold all the copies (some 550 or
so). When I’m done, I plan to spend time looking at the outline on the
site with an eye to making the changes we discussed at the meeting at
CC21. I would really appreciate feedback about this subject in
particular, so we can get to writing the content. I can write a lot of
it, but I’m not expecting to write everything!

Hint.

Thanks!

Talk to you soon,

Betsy

—
Betsy R. Delaney
Web Mistress at large

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